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      07-17-2017, 06:21 PM   #67
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This tread are showing how polarized the world have become. And how narrow minded some coutries and people have become. My choices... the best solution is the cheapest one...
I have kids, i have astma, so Yes, i like clean air, and i like to see our world survive in the future as well.
Don't we all?
Does this means we all should drive EV, probably not. People should have this choice for themselves, but i think within the next 10-15 years, alot of contries will charge alot more by the gallon. Surely every country has it's problems, be it power supply, bad roads, whatever. But when a new tech comes along, beeing as effecient as EV really is, and when the charging stadions is "everywhere". I think We should be very close to such a level in most developed coutries within 2025-2030.
US are not the obvious leader these days, China is. And they are struggling with poluted air within their cities, EV will flod the industry, not only will it be cheaper to make, it will be cheaper to maintain and for alot, it will cheaper to use as well.
Oil is not going to stop beeing used, we need it in plastic, medisin and so much more.
But i'm in the power and oil industry, Norway is pumping alot of oil up from the North sea to Alaska, but the investments, and the price on oil, have been cut by 2/3. Wind and sun energy are coming cheaper by everyday. The interest in oil are plumeting, it's yesterdays news, so from beeing the prefeered career in Norway, People will now work with other things, oil is not the future is was just for a few years ago.
Renewable energy is, and EV is Perfect in that future.

For most, the very though of driving an EV seems insane or to futuristic. But it all depens or where you live and how you look at the future. In Norway, EV busses are beeing tested, theyr beeing set in system next year. Autonomus as well. Tesla are coming with their EV truck.
Things are coming along People, it will be a step forward for most.
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      07-17-2017, 09:59 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ron_jeremy View Post
This tread are showing how polarized the world have become. And how narrow minded some coutries and people have become. My choices... the best solution is the cheapest one...
I have kids, i have astma, so Yes, i like clean air, and i like to see our world survive in the future as well.
Don't we all?
Does this means we all should drive EV, probably not. People should have this choice for themselves, but i think within the next 10-15 years, alot of contries will charge alot more by the gallon. Surely every country has it's problems, be it power supply, bad roads, whatever. But when a new tech comes along, beeing as effecient as EV really is, and when the charging stadions is "everywhere". I think We should be very close to such a level in most developed coutries within 2025-2030.
US are not the obvious leader these days, China is. And they are struggling with poluted air within their cities, EV will flod the industry, not only will it be cheaper to make, it will be cheaper to maintain and for alot, it will cheaper to use as well.
Oil is not going to stop beeing used, we need it in plastic, medisin and so much more.
But i'm in the power and oil industry, Norway is pumping alot of oil up from the North sea to Alaska, but the investments, and the price on oil, have been cut by 2/3. Wind and sun energy are coming cheaper by everyday. The interest in oil are plumeting, it's yesterdays news, so from beeing the prefeered career in Norway, People will now work with other things, oil is not the future is was just for a few years ago.
Renewable energy is, and EV is Perfect in that future.

For most, the very though of driving an EV seems insane or to futuristic. But it all depens or where you live and how you look at the future. In Norway, EV busses are beeing tested, theyr beeing set in system next year. Autonomus as well. Tesla are coming with their EV truck.
Things are coming along People, it will be a step forward for most.
Ok, you are at least being rational. The facts however aren't entirely correct.

1. Gas prices aren't going up worldwide unless it's due to countries taxing it. Obama shut off 32% of the world's oil reserves. Since then they've expanded and now that 32% will be coming back on line. More oil cheaply gotten means lower prices worldwide.
2. EV isn't as efficient as its made out to be. It has its own set of environmental problems. At the same time, ice cars become increasingly clean and efficient.
3. Gas can come from renewable resources too. See Brazil.
4. Norway oil interest is down because it had been up due to Obama cutting of access to oil in the US. This made it prodirable. Now with those restrictions going away its not as profitable.

So many of the points you are making are valid, but missing context.
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      07-23-2017, 06:42 PM   #69
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Wathch that video , we are only like 4% hybrid+electric , not even 10%
http://pmd.cdn.turner.com/money/big/...y_1024x576.mp4
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      07-23-2017, 06:54 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by dzvero View Post
Wathch that video , we are only like 4% hybrid+electric , not even 10%
http://pmd.cdn.turner.com/money/big/...y_1024x576.mp4
3.5 hybrid, which have ice, .4% EV. It's a fool's errand especially when the US administration is not imposing regulations and subsidies on the market now and the world is awash with gas for decades if not more.
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      07-23-2017, 11:10 PM   #71
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The internal combustion engine will continue to rule the world long after civilization as we know it has collapsed.

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      07-24-2017, 01:24 AM   #72
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ICE gone in a decade...not happening.

End thread.
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      07-24-2017, 08:24 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundguy1 View Post
Ok, you are at least being rational. The facts however aren't entirely correct.

1. Gas prices aren't going up worldwide unless it's due to countries taxing it. Obama shut off 32% of the world's oil reserves. Since then they've expanded and now that 32% will be coming back on line. More oil cheaply gotten means lower prices worldwide.
2. EV isn't as efficient as its made out to be. It has its own set of environmental problems. At the same time, ice cars become increasingly clean and efficient.
3. Gas can come from renewable resources too. See Brazil.
4. Norway oil interest is down because it had been up due to Obama cutting of access to oil in the US. This made it prodirable. Now with those restrictions going away its not as profitable.

So many of the points you are making are valid, but missing context.
We don't produce 32% of the worlds oil supply and haven't in any recent times. Even if Obama took U.S. production to zero he wouldn't have shut off 32% of the world's oil supply.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...oil_production


Production while Obama was in office went up drastically. Roughly 5000 to 8000 barrels per day from when he took office until when he left. This came from fracking and the price of oil, not his policies.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-...oil-production
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      07-24-2017, 09:41 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ron_jeremy View Post
Having only ICE drivetrain is coming to an end fast, ICE will be gone in 10 years time.
You think the oil money will allow that to happen?
This is old established money around for over a hundred years
Theyve lied, cheated, killed people, bribed, started wars etc .. to protect this oil market
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      07-24-2017, 02:15 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
We don't produce 32% of the worlds oil supply and haven't in any recent times. Even if Obama took U.S. production to zero he wouldn't have shut off 32% of the world's oil supply.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...oil_production


Production while Obama was in office went up drastically. Roughly 5000 to 8000 barrels per day from when he took office until when he left. This came from fracking and the price of oil, not his policies.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-...oil-production
I said reserves, not production. We have 40% of the world's oil reserves. An oil reserve is oil thats there that you can get. When Obama closed federal lands down, he took away 32% of the world's oil reserves. Prices went up making fracking and tar sands economically viable, and although we now had 8% instead of 40% of the world's oil reserves, our production increased. Fracking and tar sands brought prices down much to the consternation of Obama as he wanted $4 a gallon to push his climate change agenda but now it was back to $2 and from fracking which the left hates.

Your sights you list are correct but do not apply. Supply is how much is out of the ground. We are awash in supply. Production is how fast it is coming out. Two totally different things.
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      07-24-2017, 02:21 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundguy1 View Post
I said reserves, not production. We have 40% of the world's oil reserves. An oil reserve is oil thats there that you can get. When Obama closed federal lands down, he took away 32% of the world's oil reserves. Prices went up making fracking and tar sands economically viable, and although we now had 8% instead of 40% of the world's oil reserves, our production increased. Fracking and tar sands brought prices down much to the consternation of Obama as he wanted $4 a gallon to push his climate change agenda but now it was back to $2 and from fracking which the left hates.

Your sights you list are correct but do not apply.
WTF? how does having expensive gas push a "climate change agenda"? Gas prices go up and down because of market pressure... pushing for clean vehicles and more efficient transportation is independent of that.

Regardless of gas prices, we should be looking for independence from fossil fuels - they're limited resources and the world will run out eventually.
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      07-24-2017, 02:25 PM   #77
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WTF? how does having expensive gas push a "climate change agenda"? Gas prices go up and down because of market pressure... pushing for clean vehicles and more efficient transportation is independent of that.

Regardless of gas prices, we should be looking for independence from fossil fuels - they're limited resources and the world will run out eventually.
He wanted expensive gas to get people to buy hybrids and EVs. Pretty self explanatory. His energy secretary talked about this before he even took office sayong we needed $4 a gallon to break out oil habit. So he did the only thing he could do to raise prices dramatically his first year in office which was shut down federal lands effectively removing 1/3 of the world's oil reserves.
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      07-24-2017, 02:29 PM   #78
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I have zero problem with alternative energy sources. If they are economically viable, have at it.
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      07-24-2017, 03:16 PM   #79
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Quote:
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I have zero problem with alternative energy sources. If they are economically viable, have at it.
That's exactly what's happening these days. It's sun and wind, which is renewable and not a source with limited supply.
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      07-24-2017, 03:28 PM   #80
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That's exactly what's happening these days. It's sun and wind, which is renewable and not a source with limited supply.
Wind has limited application, is an eyesore, kills a hige amount of birds, and is not yet economically viable. Sun is getting better buy not there yet. At the moment we'd need to cover the state of Nevada with panels to meet our electrical needs. Nuclear, hydro are both viable. Fuel thats grown like ethanol, biodiesel. In the mean time, natural gas and clean coal are and should be ramped up.
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      07-24-2017, 03:53 PM   #81
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Snicker. You bought that clean coal bullshit.
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      07-24-2017, 03:56 PM   #82
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17% of TX power comes from wind. Works great, chops up some birds, but nothing like house cats, so I'm not too concerned. It doesn't puke its guts into Prudhoe Bay or go all Fukushima on us.
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      07-24-2017, 04:52 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundguy1 View Post
He wanted expensive gas to get people to buy hybrids and EVs. Pretty self explanatory. His energy secretary talked about this before he even took office sayong we needed $4 a gallon to break out oil habit. So he did the only thing he could do to raise prices dramatically his first year in office which was shut down federal lands effectively removing 1/3 of the world's oil reserves.
It only makes sense for people to go to whatever is cheaper to fulfill their needs.

The price of electricity and renewable energy sources is dropping dramatically. Even without high gas prices, it will eventually over take fossil fuels. And fossil fuels will run dry or become so expensive to pump out of the ground that it isnt feasible.

Even as a car enthusiast, I am all for electric cars and alternative fuels. I can drive my electric car for boring commuting and it'll leave more gasoline for me to burn on my fun drives.
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      07-24-2017, 04:56 PM   #84
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17% of TX power comes from wind. Works great, chops up some birds, but nothing like house cats, so I'm not too concerned. It doesn't puke its guts into Prudhoe Bay or go all Fukushima on us.
I don't see a tidal wave hitting Houston. Over 250 nuclear plants in the US since the 70s. No reason we shouldn't have more.
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      07-24-2017, 05:01 PM   #85
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I just get mad when liberals stop a dam from being built because a unique guppy in a pond could be impacted but are fine with wind turbines killing off thousands of bald eagles a year.
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      07-24-2017, 05:04 PM   #86
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It only makes sense for people to go to whatever is cheaper to fulfill their needs.

The price of electricity and renewable energy sources is dropping dramatically. Even without high gas prices, it will eventually over take fossil fuels. And fossil fuels will run dry or become so expensive to pump out of the ground that it isnt feasible.

Even as a car enthusiast, I am all for electric cars and alternative fuels. I can drive my electric car for boring commuting and it'll leave more gasoline for me to burn on my fun drives.
It just has to hit critical mass where renewable and electric are superior I agree. But that's decades if not centuries away.
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      07-24-2017, 05:05 PM   #87
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I just get mad when liberals stop a dam from being built because a unique guppy in a pond could be impacted but are fine with wind turbines killing off thousands of bald eagles a year.
100 per year? That's the actual estimate. Not saying it's a good thing, but I'd bet that more are killed by bubbas and similar numbnuts per year, and they don't provide anything back to society but truck nuts.
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      07-24-2017, 05:07 PM   #88
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I just get mad when liberals stop a dam from being built because a unique guppy in a pond could be impacted but are fine with wind turbines killing off thousands of bald eagles a year.
And let's not forget that dams reroute rivers, change topography and generally don't have any long term benefits. See one Hoover Dam for examples.
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