Ergonomics Wish List

[dbs600]

1. Relocate the central door lock button to the two front doors

2. Relocate the radio volume knob to somewhere near the iDrive control knob

3. Split the radio volume and the radio track / seek buttons on the steering wheel between the left and right steering wheel button clusters

4. Ability to program / modify steering wheel button functionality

Thoughts / Comments?

[cracker123]

1. More control on easy entry / exit feature
2. Profiles don't seem to be holding very well on some items like HUD, so better profiles
3. Fix the key next to the car discharge problem not related to Ergonomics
4. Massage on the rear seats should , work on the bottom seat also not just the top.
5. Massage on the front seats should work on the top not just the bottom, i dont't understand the logic on having only one seat portion working. S class does both ?

[xDrive50i]

@dbs600:

1. I like the location of the button where it is just fine. It's called a central door lock button for a reason

2. Why would you want to relocate the volume button? You have the controls right in front of you within finger reach on your steering wheel! I wouldn't want them to clutter up the area around the iDrive controller with unnecessary buttons. I think the place where the volume button is right now is just perfect.

3. Some other BMW models have the volume control buttons on the left side of the steering wheel and two programmable buttons on the right. I have to say I like the layout of the 7 series steering wheel best. The cruise control and distance control functions are all grouped together on the left and the entertainment buttons are on the right. Perfect!

4. This is something they have on other BMW models with generic buttons on the steering wheel where you can pick from a list of different options. I honestly have not found a need for any other function on the steering wheel as all the most used functions are already on the steering wheel, except maybe a mute function... but other than that, I think it's perfect too...

[dbs600]

xDrive:

w/r/t #2: So that there's no need to move your hand away from the iDrive controller at all when driving. Audi's cars are set up in the way suggested and I believe it works better. I find it annoying to move my hand from the iDrive controller, to the dashboard, and then back to the iDrive controller; however, if the volume control was on the left portion of the steering wheel...

w/r/t #3: My rationale was: What's the point with all of the radio controls to the right, if your right hand is usually resting by the iDrive controller while driving? With repositioning, one would be able to maintain control of the steering wheel and turn up/down the volume of the radio with the left hand and change the channels, etc. with the right hand - on the iDrive controller.

Otherwise, additions to the list:

5. Relocate turn signal indicators to areas of the instrument cluster that are more visible, taking into account all steering wheel versions offered. I am 6 feet tall and with the BMW Individual Wood Inlay Steering Wheel and I cannot see the turn signal indicators AT ALL when the wheel comfortably positioned; very annoying / upsetting!

6. Reposition the cup holder cover to flip the other way so that it is easier to see / feel for what is inside the cup holder area if used for something other than beverages; but this needs to be worked out with the ash tray cover.

7. Reposition the front left and right vent open / close knobs so that they are positioned to the inside side of the vents (to the right of the driver's side vent and to the left of the passenger's side vent), so that the passenger side vent knob is easier to reach from the driver's seat if one wishes to close it from same.

8. Utilize a center console storage compartment lid similar to that of the Mercedes-Benz W221 S-Class, which allows for optimum ability to see / reach inside the compartment from either the driver's or passenger's seat depending on which side it is opened from.

9. Does anyone else feel there is a bit of a blind spot by the A-pillars and the side view mirrors? For such small mirrors, the mirrors and the pillars seem to obstruct one's outward view disproportionately to their size...?

[xDrive50i]

dbs600: W/r/t #2: Your right hand should REALLY be on the steering wheel and NOT on the iDrive controller while you are driving
Besides how often do you have to change the volume on your radio??? I have to try and remember the last time I changed the volume on the radio. For the most part I have it set a particular volume and only have to change it when I have company in the car and have a conversation and just want the radio (actually it's usually music from my USB stick) playing softly in the background...

On a side note, when I decided to buy the 750 over the A8, one of my dislikes of the Audi where all the buttons, buttons and more buttons, while I am driving, I want to concentrate on the road and not have to look for a damn button, so the fewer buttons the better!

w/r/t #3: Again, your hands should be on the steering wheel where they belong. Last time I checked, the steering wheel controls where you are going and not the iDrive controller
When I'm driving, I usually have the navigation map on the screen. If I need to change radio stations, I can do that with the right hand side scroll wheel. Again, no need to go back to the iDrive controller!
Most of the time, I even use the voice commands to change the radio station, again, no need to use the iDrive controller. The only time I use the iDrive controller while driving is usually to change the scale of the map (although you can do that via voice commands too). You can even tell the radio to turn off via voice control, so in a sense, you don't 'really' need a mute button either

5. I'm about 6 feet tall too, have the steering wheel all the way down while driving (for me that's the most comfortable position) and the way I adjusted the seats, I can see the turn signals just fine, then again, I can also hear the turn signals just fine even when listening to music...
If I'm not mistaken, pretty much all manufacturers have the turn signal indicators roughly in about the same location in the instrument cluster (I could be wrong though). I for one never had a problem with either the sound level or location/positioning of the indicators. I am sure that BMW does PLENTY of ergonomic studies with all kinds of people (shape and size) to figure out the perfect placement for all the controls.

6. Never had an issue with the cup holder or the cover for that matter. I also don't really put anything else in there other than a cup or mug...
Although the cover opening towards you does seem a bit odd, but it doesn't bother me.

7. Wow, ok, well I never had the need to close the passenger side vent from the driver side. In fact I never even changed the settings, I believe my wife may have but I don't think I ever had the need to do that. Why would you want to do that anyway? If you need to control the passenger side air flow, use the controls on the dashboard since you can control the temperature and air volume that way!

8. Personally, I have no problems with the center console storage area, I keep my sunglasses and a cloth to clean them along with the iPod cable (never used it though) and my USB memory stick in there. Don't have anything else that I would need to store in there and that's fine for my usage. I can see that for some people the storage space might be a bit small and that the phone adapter tray can get in the way...

9. Nope, drive some other cars with larger mirrors or slanted A-pillars with large panels that cover the bottom portion between the door and the windshield (some trucks and Mini-vans come to mind) and and see what kind of a blind spot you get then

I think you need to design your own car for the amount of 'flaws' you seem to find with this car

[cracker123]

also maybe back light the left and right control stalks in the night. ?

On the S the volume is next to the Command controller, clicking it once mutes the audio.

[dbs600]

Yes, cracker, you're correct, the W221 S-Class also has the volume control knob next to the controller; which would be the ideal place (for me, at least)!

Otherwise, xDrive, I change the radio volume all the time. When changing stations or simply going from song to song; volume levels are different.

I'm not sure if you're joking (w/ the smileys), but the only time I drive with both hands is when I'm barreling down the highway at 70+ MPH, as all other times, it's mostly with my left hand, as I usually keep my right hand on the iDrive controller and change radio stations, etc. from there frequently; not using the steering wheel knob or the presets on the dash. It's a very neat feeling scrolling down the station list with the iDrive knob.

On the prior generation 5 Series, the blinkers were positioned totally differently: to the outer most edges of the instrument cluster instead of between the speedometer and tachometer; I know this because I currently have one as a loaner.

I close the passenger vent flap on my cars when its either really hot or really cold out, when I want to get the maximum possible performance out of the other vents that face me - blower capacity. One of my other cars, a W140 S-Class, has rotary dials for the vent flaps all in one place, below the center vents, which enables the driver to easily close the passenger side vent, which was ideal (over engineered and last car true to being a Mercedes-Benz - my absolute favorite of all time).

[cracker123]

Interface design is very interesting. People are used to a certain style based on what they have been using. Getting them to use a new style even if it is better is a hard thing to do.

[xDrive50i]

Well, the volume and entertainment function controls are all easily reachable and perfectly located on the steering wheel, if you don't use them where they are, then I would think that is a problem you have and not so much a problem with the car or the location of the buttons. Wouldn't you agree?

As for the location of the turn signal indicators, I think it may also be a matter of how you adjust your seat. Personally, I think they are in a perfect place and I have no issues with them as I can see them. I'm sure there are other people that have the same problem as you do and they can't see them either, but then again, if they were to put them somewhere else, other people would complain saying they can't see them... you can't please everybody...

You can scroll through your favorite radio stations just as easily via the steering wheel mounted scroll wheel (and at least for me, I find it' easier to see the stations in the instrument cluster than having to look over to the iDrive screen).

The air volume should NOT change on the driver side if you close the passenger vents as you have independent control of the air volume for the passenger and driver side! Otherwise the independent climate control function wouldn't make much sense.

Out of curiosity, if you think that the MB has/had all the features and the controls in the location you want them to be, why didn't you buy that car instead?

I'm not saying that this car is 100% perfect (there is always room for improvement), I just find it odd that you are nit-picking on something you could apparently have had in other cars you mentioned?!?

[dbs600]

Woah, what's going on here xDrive!? I'm not complaining, am I!? The title of the thread is "Wish List"...

Funny enough, when dropping off the 5 Series loaner today, I noticed that the steering wheel has the split radio control functionality I speak of (with the volume button on the left portion of the wheel), the left and right HVAC vents have the open/close knobs located by their 'inner' portions, so that the driver can reach the passenger side vent control knob, as well as the previously mentioned location of the turn signal indicators on the instrument cluster, in a more visible place to the left and right of the speedometer and tachometer, instead of between them.

As far as wanting to shut the passenger side air vent, I do this because, as mentioned, I want maximum vent blowing capacity. If one were to point the driver's side vent and the two center vents towards the driver, closing the passenger side vent increases the performance of the center vent on the passenger side, and, I do believe, throughout the system in general.

If Mercedes still made the W140 S-Class, I'd buy an additional new one in a heartbeat! But, sadly, they do not. I never said that the S-Class has all that I want! Where did you get this from? Debating between the current 7 and the current S was one of the most difficult decisions, auto related, I've ever had to make! And, guess what... 7 won out! But truth be told, locating the radio volume knob near the iDrive controller would really be a much better place, and it seems as though both Mercedes and Audi have already realized this.

Another ergonomic issue, for those with the Luxury Rear Seating Package:

10: The seat controls should be moved off of the rear armrest, as if 3 people are sitting in the rear, the outboard passengers cannot adjust their seats with the armrest is stowed.

[xDrive50i]

Sorry if you thought I was attacking you, wasn't my intention and I apologize if I came across that way!

See, if they would have or would move the turn signal indicators to the outside (away from where they currently are) I wouldn't be able to see them as they would be covered by the steering wheel in the location I currently have them, so what doesn't seem to work for you works perfectly fine for me

As to the ventilation system, there are 4 independent zones (that is if you have the 4 zone climate control system). Which means that each zone is independent from the others, which also means that if you change the air flow on the driver side, it will not impact the amount of air coming out of the passenger or rear vents. The only exception is if you have the ALL button pressed in which case you control (override) the temp and air volume of all other zones, until someone adjust any of the other zones at which point that zone will be back on it's own control but the remaining (untouched) zone will still have the last setting you used for the driver side but they will no longer change with the driver settings until you press the ALL button again...

So it doesn't matter if you close the passenger side vent or not, the amount of air coming from the driver side vents will not change unless you change the actual settings for the driver side via the dash board controls!

What you are referring to is (was) the way cars without individual zone control work(ed)!

As to the volume controls on the steering wheels being on the left hand side, the older 3 series and 5 series used to be like that. The newer (F series) cars steering controls are or will be the same as that of the 7 series (sharing more and more parts among the different models to reduce the overall cost). At least as far as I can remember the 5 GT and the new F10 series are that way...
Same goes for the vents and their controls... That's just the way they are going right now.

In regards to your 10. I fully agree, I think since they added the new 5 seating arrangement option, they will have to re-think the controls. It works fine the way it is if you only have 4 people in the car and have the armrest down...
Mind you, if a 5th person is sitting in the middle position, you can't use the rear iDrive controller and hence it makes it really difficult to control the screens!

[dbs600]

Tim in Ca feels my pain w/r/t the indicators here: http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=511691. Anyway, as you say, what works for some does not work for all all. But the reason why I believe it will work for more people with the way the prior generation 5 was setup as opposed to our 7's is that the indicators are actually lower / more in the middle of the instrument cluster verses the very top edge of ours. Surely, you're able to see items that are more central.

Otherwise, you're still misunderstanding me w/r/t to the vents. There are two vents in front of the driver and two vents in front of the passenger. If you shut the right vent in front of the passenger, the left vent in front of the passenger will blow harder. So, if there's no passenger and you angle the left vent in front of the passenger towards the driver, the driver will get more 'air'. As simple as that.

Anyway, that's all I've got on this stuff for now.

[dbs600]

Has anyone else scratched their wrist on the latch of the storage compartment to the left of the steering wheel when removing your hand from same after placing something in or removing something from same?

[xDrive50i]

Can't say I ever have scratched myself on the latch, nope...
I don't really use it very often though... but at least it's nice to have an extra storage place...

[edlee]

I'd prefer all cruise control functions on a stalk (below the signal stalk like in the E60 and E65) instead of on the steering wheel. Its so confusing when you need to use the different functions. It also frees up space on the steering wheel for other functions.

[xDrive50i]

@edlee: See I'm the exact opposite, I never liked the cruise control functions on the little stalk (I found them to be confusing, when I wanted to increase or decrease the speed, I would always end up disabling the cruise control) but I LOVE the steering wheel controls on the 7 series... especially the speed up or slow down via the little dual function control button in the center and the distance control via the two buttons right above and below the speed control. It's laid out logically and in a perfect place to control via the left hand!

[dbs600]

11. The HVAC button stack should be placed above the radio button stack, like that of the prior generation 5 and 7, so that the temperature settings / readouts are at a higher line of sight that does not require you to look down as much, allowing more of your peripheral vision to stay with the road, and that does not require you to raise your hand as high to change the volume of the radio, which is likely done more frequently than adjusting the temperature.

[xDrive50i]

The drawback with your #11 is that you will have a harder time putting the CDs or DVDs into the drive slot! Especially if you have a bottle or cup in the cup holder, you will first have to take the bottle or cup out to be able to insert the disc...

[dbs600]

Originally Posted by xDrive50i

The drawback with your #11 is that you will have a harder time putting the CDs or DVDs into the drive slot! Especially if you have a bottle or cup in the cup holder, you will first have to take the bottle or cup out to be able to insert the disc...

You're right!

[dbs600]

12. The automatic seatbelt tensioners should tension only when the car is in drive and reaches a certain speed, similar to the automatic door locks, because it’s annoying when they tension as you put the car in reverse to back out of a spot, as you turn to look over your shoulder, out the rear window.

[xDrive50i]

@dbs600: #12: Fully agree, it's annoying when the seat belt tensioner pulls you back just as you are starting to reverse the car and you try to look over your shoulder to look out the rear side windows...

[dbs600]

13. Map pockets at the rear of the front seats need to be 'deeper', as I cannot fit a newspaper without it curving away and not being flush with the seatback...