MT unimpressed by the new 7 series....(Comparison test: 750 vs S550 vs A8L)

[OBI_agent]

THIRD PLACE: BMW 750LI

The new 7 Series isn't a luxury sedan. It's an instruction manual on four wheels. That's not hyperbole: So complex and mechanically intimidating is this new machine, BMW has wisely incorporated the operating instructions for the myriad systems right into the on-board hard drive (you can summon pages using the iDrive controller). That's if, of course, you can figure out how to call up the manual first.

This is engineering run rampant. It's as if BMW, like the rocket scientists in "The Right Stuff," regards the human almost as "a redundant component." Can this new 7 Series really be from the same company that builds the M3, perhaps the world's single finest all-around automobile -- a car that functions as an extension of the driver's feet and hands? The 7 seems to deny that relationship at every turn. When our test car arrived, I ambled down to the MT garage to find technical editor Kim Reynolds sitting in the back seat, attempting to use the rear-seat entertainment system ($2200). "Well, I've been fiddling for a few minutes now," he said. "Still haven't got any sound."

That's the 750Li in a nutshell. It's the Windows Vista of luxury cars. The Side View cameras, for instance, sound intriguing in theory, but in practice the view they provide is difficult to interpret. How far away is that car coming at me really? Do I trust this camera's message and pull out now? Am I upside down? The Night Vision view is similarly frustrating. Yes, it's great fun at stoplights -- you can see the heat fading off the tires of the car stopped in front of you, then watch the heat trace on the road as it drives away. As a practical device for detecting humans (or, say, deer) in the road ahead, however, it's nearly impossible to monitor the display while driving (the system is a $2600 option).

2009 BMW 750Li Front View
CLICK TO VIEW GALLERY

Scan the test results, and the 750Li presumes to be a star. And, indeed, it dusted off its two rivals in straight-line sprints, at just 4.9 seconds to 60 mph nipping the S550 by 0.4 seconds and the A8L by 1.4. It also posted the best braking and figure-eight results, albeit by the tiniest of margins. Yet off the clock the BMW pleased none of us. Throttle and transmission response is herky-jerky, thwarting all attempts to impress your passengers with your driving smoothness-and at the same time damping your enthusiasm. Steering feel is just...okay (our test car did not have the optional Active Steering). The chassis, despite those whiz-bang adaptive shocks and all that processing power, fails at both handling poise and ride comfort. The dour interior doesn't delight the eyes or your tactile senses. Our test car even emitted an annoying background fan or gear whine that seemed to follow throttle movements. This from a $105,370 luxury sedan -- and a brand-new design at that?

Summed up senior editor Ed Loh in the logbook: "No question the BMW is a fast, fast getaway sedan -- the one you want when you're carting a boatload of dough out of Terry Benedict's casino. Squash the gas pedal and the big 7 just goes and goes. The problem is, that's about all it does. Its lazy throttle response, turbo lag -- whatever the problem is -- kneecaps the car in situations when full throttle isn't required (99 percent of the time). I can forgive a luxury sedan that gets this formula wrong the other way -- buttery smooth most of the time, hopeless in full-throttle situations. This is unconscionable."

To read the whole article...click under here
Comparison test

Spoiler.....The winner is !

[jhans7154]

Get the fuck outta here. This new 7 is beyond a luxury car. Who are these people that write these lame reviews? This hating ass review shouldnt even be allowed on this site, its direspecting the new 7 in its own home.

[OBI_agent]

Originally Posted by jhans7154

This new 7 is beyond a luxury car. Who are these people that write these lame reviews? This hating ass review shouldnt even be allowed on this site, its direspecting the new 7 in its own home.

Dude, I saw your sig and I'm jealous(750i on order ).

Anyway, I'm also disappointed with their review but everyone is entitled to their opinions. Something must have been really wrong with the 750i loaner they got. As everyone is singing praises for the new 7 series.

About your car, do share pics and your review.

[xDrive50i]

Well, I can honestly say that I am UNIMPRESSED by motortrends review

Or maybe I should say more precisely, I am unimpressed by the reviewers/authors intelligence!

I test drove all 3 of the above listed cars, the 750i almost fully loaded except the sport package but with the integral active steering and the roll stabilization system, next was the S550 AMG 4Matic and then the A8, all of them were the latest versions available at the time I test drove them (back in February). I took all of them along the exact same route to be able to compare the ride comfort, suspension, performance and handling. The route included some freeway/highway, city streets and some twisty back roads for a total of about 1 hour drive plus about 30 minutes before the drive to get to know the car a bit. Now I obviously didn't have any gear to test acceleration/performance like some of these magazines have. For acceleration, it was the good old 'seat of the pants' feeling and the new 750 felt the fastest (and to that extent, I guess the above article confirms that). Handling wise, I would say the 750 handled best, followed by the A8 and the S550 last (I didn't like the 'sofa/couch soft ride of the S550). Overall, I rank the 750i first place, the S550 second and the A8 a distant 3rd. I do like the external looks of the S550 but as hard as I tried, I just can't stand the interior of the S550...
I was really disappointed with the A8, I found the car to be overpriced for the materials they chose. If they asked half of what they are asking for that car, that I would be willing to pay for! It most certainly does not feel like you were sitting in a $100k+ car that's for sure. I had a good friend of mine with me on all 3 test drives and we sort of 'compared' notes after each test drive and he pointed out a few things and details from a passenger point of view that I as the driver didn't see, feel or hear during the test drives. Interestingly enough, his conclusions were almost the same as mine and that was very interesting for me as he is a total MB fan. He told me that he was really impressed with the new 750!

Now in regards to the the guy that wrote the review, if he couldn't figure out the new iDrive system, it speaks volumes of how low is IQ is

That system is by far the easiest of all 3 car manufactures to learn/handle. I had no issues figuring out all 3 of them but do have to praise the new iDrive system over the other two. You would sort of expect that since it is the newest of all of them and BMW has (thankfully) learned from the shortcomings of it's previous generation iDrive systems.

[BimmerGuyFL]

Look at the specs of the 750Li in this review you will be able to tell that not only did they not have the Sports Package but they didn't have the option included on the test car for the Active roll stabilization system. This would have greatly changed the handling test numbers between all three cars.

[SpotM5]

Originally Posted by xDrive50i

Well, I can honestly say that I am UNIMPRESSED by motortrends review

Or maybe I should say more precisely, I am unimpressed by the reviewers/authors intelligence!

I test drove all 3 of the above listed cars, the 750i almost fully loaded except the sport package but with the integral active steering and the roll stabilization system, next was the S550 AMG 4Matic and then the A8, all of them were the latest versions available at the time I test drove them (back in February). I took all of them along the exact same route to be able to compare the ride comfort, suspension, performance and handling. The route included some freeway/highway, city streets and some twisty back roads for a total of about 1 hour drive plus about 30 minutes before the drive to get to know the car a bit. Now I obviously didn't have any gear to test acceleration/performance like some of these magazines have. For acceleration, it was the good old 'seat of the pants' feeling and the new 750 felt the fastest (and to that extent, I guess the above article confirms that). Handling wise, I would say the 750 handled best, followed by the A8 and the S550 last (I didn't like the 'sofa/couch soft ride of the S550). Overall, I rank the 750i first place, the S550 second and the A8 a distant 3rd. I do like the external looks of the S550 but as hard as I tried, I just can't stand the interior of the S550...
I was really disappointed with the A8, I found the car to be overpriced for the materials they chose. If they asked half of what they are asking for that car, that I would be willing to pay for! It most certainly does not feel like you were sitting in a $100k+ car that's for sure. I had a good friend of mine with me on all 3 test drives and we sort of 'compared' notes after each test drive and he pointed out a few things and details from a passenger point of view that I as the driver didn't see, feel or hear during the test drives. Interestingly enough, his conclusions were almost the same as mine and that was very interesting for me as he is a total MB fan. He told me that he was really impressed with the new 750!

Now in regards to the the guy that wrote the review, if he couldn't figure out the new iDrive system, it speaks volumes of how low is IQ is

That system is by far the easiest of all 3 car manufactures to learn/handle. I had no issues figuring out all 3 of them but do have to praise the new iDrive system over the other two. You would sort of expect that since it is the newest of all of them and BMW has (thankfully) learned from the shortcomings of it's previous generation iDrive systems.

XDrive - I agree with you 100%. Like I said before, these "reporter" spend very little time in these cars. The updated iDrive is soooo easy to use, my 8 year old daughter controls it for me when I drive her to school. Go figure MT..... All I can say is credibility and honest reporting is critical. Having a biased unobjective report hurts the magazine more than words can say.

Also- there was a cover article on a car mag this month how the CTS-V whooped the M5. Keep in mind they are comparing a 2006 chassis to a 2009 car. Still the M5 was extremely close on all fronts - but who wants a Caddy? I love the CTS-V motor and the ZR-1, but come on guys....

[dm5272]

I like your review better xdrive!

Originally Posted by BimmerGuyFL

Look at the specs of the 750Li in this review you will be able to tell that not only did they not have the Sports Package but they didn't have the option included on the test car for the Active roll stabilization system. This would have greatly changed the handling test numbers between all three cars.

Sports Pacakge is great - but don't get it confused - It is mostly accessories, and nothing special. The Sports Suspension is still included in the car without the "Sports Package"
The review states no "active steering" option, and that would have improved handing - but not having the Sports Package does not change the handling by much in the car. You still have the Sports option in the car and Sports Plus - Sports mainly adds a diff trim to the ext of car, and interior cloth on the roof liner - and a thicker steering wheel. What we dont konw is if the car included the Active Stabilization option - this would have also helped. (both options avail in some countries without the sports package (btw)

This reviewer sounds like he was NOT going to give this car a better review with or without the sports package. And seems almost offended by the car.

I have driven the A8 and the 7 - no comparison, 7 by far the best handling car.

[xDrive50i]

Originally Posted by dm5272

I like your review better xdrive!




Sports Pacakge is great - but don't get it confused - It is mostly accessories, and nothing special. The Sports Suspension is still included in the car without the "Sports Package"
The review states no "active steering" option, and that would have improved handing - but not having the Sports Package does not change the handling by much in the car. You still have the Sports option in the car and Sports Plus - Sports mainly adds a diff trim to the ext of car, and interior cloth on the roof liner - and a thicker steering wheel. What we dont konw is if the car included the Active Stabilization option - this would have also helped. (both options avail in some countries without the sports package (btw)

This reviewer sounds like he was NOT going to give this car a better review with or without the sports package. And seems almost offended by the car.

I have driven the A8 and the 7 - no comparison, 7 by far the best handling car.

Thanks for the compliments dm5272

I agree with you on the handling between the A8 and the 7...

[a burrito]

The magazine does praise the 7's performance. I don't know what all you guys are griping about? Maybe because half of you guys have one on order. Truth is, the group that chooses the 7 has performance on the top of their list while luxury is second best.

I too have driven all cars and sitting inside the A8L and the S550, I felt far more pampered in those two than the plain yet nice fitting BMW interior. This is 100k territory guys; and on a wheelbase and weight combination that exceeds any M3. This is no sports car nor a children's car. While i don't always agree with MT's reports, for the type of car a full size sedan is supposed to be it should have all the luxuries, performance (nowadays) smoothness, refinement, and looks a car of this class/price demands. They looked for the full package and obviously the 7 fell short but it was still the fastest of the group.

[spidey 7]

I would strongly urge anyone interested in a more comprehensive review to see the US New and World Report (see website) review of super luxury cars including A8 and S550. The 2009 7 series was ranked #1 on multiple criteria. The MT review reminds me of the Consumer Reports reviews of any BMW with an idrive, they spend little time behind the wheel and aren't interested in learning the system.

[Fastbuck]

Originally Posted by spidey 7

I would strongly urge anyone interested in a more comprehensive review to see the US New and World Report (see website) review of super luxury cars including A8 and S550. The 2009 7 series was ranked #1 on multiple criteria. The MT review reminds me of the Consumer Reports reviews of any BMW with an idrive, they spend little time behind the wheel and aren't interested in learning the system.

Do you have the URL?

TIA

[spidey 7]

http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...r-Luxury-Cars/

[xDrive50i]

Originally Posted by spidey 7

http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...r-Luxury-Cars/

Thanks for the link!

It's an interesting site. They basically take ALL the published reviews and combine them into a sort of master review/ranking system.

[BimmerGuyFL]

Originally Posted by dm5272

I like your review better xdrive!




Sports Pacakge is great - but don't get it confused - It is mostly accessories, and nothing special. The Sports Suspension is still included in the car without the "Sports Package"
The review states no "active steering" option, and that would have improved handing - but not having the Sports Package does not change the handling by much in the car. You still have the Sports option in the car and Sports Plus - Sports mainly adds a diff trim to the ext of car, and interior cloth on the roof liner - and a thicker steering wheel. What we dont konw is if the car included the Active Stabilization option - this would have also helped. (both options avail in some countries without the sports package (btw)

This reviewer sounds like he was NOT going to give this car a better review with or without the sports package. And seems almost offended by the car.

I have driven the A8 and the 7 - no comparison, 7 by far the best handling car.

If you look at the artical closely you will notice that the 750Li did not have the active roll system........look at the final page of the comparision where it shows the stats. In the stats look at the Front and Rear suspenion, it states Antiroll bars not Active Roll bars. In pervious stats for the 5-series and 7-Series with ARS it will state it, however this test loaner did not have it.

[Fastbuck]

Originally Posted by spidey 7

http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...r-Luxury-Cars/

Thanks

[Master Deep]

Ok we all know that the 7 will handle and perform the best. But does anyone want to offer any input on the laggy and jerky throttle response?

[xDrive50i]

Originally Posted by Master Deep

Ok we all know that the 7 will handle and perform the best. But does anyone want to offer any input on the laggy and jerky throttle response?

???? What are you talking about ???

When I test drove the 750 back in February, it was buttery smooth. No hint of any turbo lag whatsoever and even the tranny behaved very nicely and shifted smoothly up or down. I tried both a 'relaxed' kind of driving style as well as very 'aggressive' driving style to see how the car would handle.

[Master Deep]

Originally Posted by xDrive50i

???? What are you talking about ???

When I test drove the 750 back in February, it was buttery smooth. No hint of any turbo lag whatsoever and even the tranny behaved very nicely and shifted smoothly up or down. I tried both a 'relaxed' kind of driving style as well as very 'aggressive' driving style to see how the car would handle.

lol well that's good. I only brought up that question because Motortrend really hated that aspect of the 7. Saying it jerks passengers around even when trying to drive smoothly.

[xDrive50i]

Originally Posted by Master Deep

lol well that's good. I only brought up that question because Motortrend really hated that aspect of the 7. Saying it jerks passengers around even when trying to drive smoothly.

Well, I guess you can make even the smoothest shifting transmission jerk passengers around depending on your driving style

[SpotM5]

Umm, nice pic Master deep!

regarding the lag - all cars have some type of minor lag- even my M5 is jerky due to the SMG transmission. In my F01, there is really no significant noticeable lag - it is butter smooth. If anything the car is super smooth and the speed is unnoticable. I just got a fricken ticket in the car going 90 mph while I was on the speaker phone......

I love when you can hear the turbo's whine. i drive with the car in sport mode most of the time. if the test driver was in comfort - i know it starts in second gear - not sure about normal mode. for whatever reason - they all tend to raise the bar much much higher for the new 7. This is simply the best out there right now.

[750_ooomph]

Originally Posted by a burrito

The magazine does praise the 7's performance. I don't know what all you guys are griping about? Maybe because half of you guys have one on order. Truth is, the group that chooses the 7 has performance on the top of their list while luxury is second best.

I too have driven all cars and sitting inside the A8L and the S550, I felt far more pampered in those two than the plain yet nice fitting BMW interior. This is 100k territory guys; and on a wheelbase and weight combination that exceeds any M3. This is no sports car nor a children's car. While i don't always agree with MT's reports, for the type of car a full size sedan is supposed to be it should have all the luxuries, performance (nowadays) smoothness, refinement, and looks a car of this class/price demands. They looked for the full package and obviously the 7 fell short but it was still the fastest of the group.

All 3 are luxury cars so luxury is standard. What's not standard is BMW handling/driver involvement. When you are looking for cars like these you want the one that balances luxury and handling. There is something special about BMW handling.