BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   7Post - 7 Series Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General BMW News and Cars Discussion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-27-2017, 10:42 PM   #1
The Automotive Enthusiast
Retired BMW Genius
The Automotive Enthusiast's Avatar
United_States
2895
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2018 Audi S5 Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: DMV

iTrader: (1)

Victims claim BMW, others knew about Takata airbag problem 'for years'

BIMMERPOST
     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
Quote:
Lawyers for victims and their families suing air bag maker Takata Corp. and five automakers allege the car companies knew Takata’s air bags were dangerous yet continued to use them for years because the devices were inexpensive and they had a desire for uninterrupted revenues in the billions.

“They were focused on the low price of Takata’s inflators and concerned that if they stopped using (them), they might not have a sufficient supply, which would prevent them from selling vehicles and generating billions of dollars in revenue,” said a status report filed Monday in Miami by lead plaintiff attorney Peter Prieo.

The allegations against Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Ford and BMW were made on the same day the Japanese auto supplier will be in a Detroit courtroom to plead guilty to wire fraud and pay $1 billion in criminal penalties stemming from the company’s fraudulent conduct related to sales of defective air bag inflators.

In the court filing, Prieo cited specific examples of evidence from Honda, Toyota, Ford, Nissan and BMW, including an allegation that Ford chose Takata’s inflators over the objections of Ford’s own inflator expert.

The federal court in Miami is handling pretrial evidence-gathering in dozens of lawsuits against Takata and the automakers. The filing says the allegations are partly based on auto company documents.

Earlier, the automakers had contended that Takata was the problem because it admitted to covering up the defective inflators, which can blow apart and hurl shrapnel into drivers and passengers. In the court filing, plaintiffs lawyers allege that the automakers were “far from innocent” in the case, and that they had independent knowledge that Takata’s air bag inflators were unsafe before putting them in millions of vehicles.

“The automotive defendants were aware that rupture after rupture, both during testing and in the field, confirmed how dangerous and defective Takata’s air bags were,” the attorneys allege in the court document, called a “status report.”

Messages were left Monday morning for all five automakers. Toyota declined to comment.

Takata’s air bag inflators can explode with too much force, hurling shrapnel into drivers and passengers. The inflators are blamed for at least 16 deaths worldwide and more than 180 injuries. The problem touched off the largest automotive recall in U.S. history involving 42 million vehicles and 60 million inflators.

Unlike most other air bag makers, Takata uses the explosive chemical ammonium nitrate to inflate air bags instantly in a crash. But the chemical can deteriorate when exposed to prolonged airborne moisture.

Federal prosecutors in Detroit reached a settlement with Takata — one of the world’s largest suppliers of automotive safety equipment — after a 25-month international investigation into the Tokyo-based company’s faulty air bags that have been linked to at least 17 deaths.

Three former Takata executives have been indicted on wire fraud charges. The indictments are part of a criminal resolution between U.S. regulators and the Japanese air bag maker.

Takata has agreed to implement rigorous internal controls, retain a compliance monitor for three years and cooperate fully with the department’s ongoing investigation.

Under the terms of the plea agreement, $125 million of the fine will be used for injured individuals who haven’t reached separate settlements while $850 million will be made available to automakers for air bag recall and replacement costs.

The remaining $25 million is a fine in the case. A court-appointed special master will oversee administration of the $975 million in restitution funds. Both sides agreed to recommend Ken Feinberg to serve as special master.

That appointment will need judicial approval by U.S. District Court Judge George Caram Steeh.

Closure with the Justice Department wraps up the criminal portion of Takata’s auto safety recall, which was the largest in history, and allows it to proceed with its hunt for a buyer.
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bus...arge/98469000/
Appreciate 2
Dackelone10525.50
1M Tex240.00
      02-28-2017, 07:26 AM   #2
Maynard
Colonel
United_States
3832
Rep
2,867
Posts

Drives: 228iX & M2C
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Upstate NY

iTrader: (1)

Oh, so they were finally motivated to settle - by needing a buyer. Kind of like those millions of drivers who are now motivated to get the recall done, since they are considering whether they can sell a car with an active safety recall. If the DOJ grew a pair and firmly nixed any sales until fixed, and made the original companies do a buyback, this would have been history long ago. These wrist-slapper fines are a huge erosion of our quality of life, even if they appear innocuous - they undermine the fabric of everyday life. If penalties don't hurt the guilty parties enough to make others think twice, then they aren't doing the job. Think about how many little pieces of equipment you rely upon for your everyday safety and peace of mind, and how many millions could be 'saved' by cheaping out on them - I mean, all those extra safety systems in an elevator - what a waste - those never really get used do they? Who'd know if they just didn't replace them next time?
Appreciate 8
      02-28-2017, 07:37 AM   #3
Dackelone
European Editor
Dackelone's Avatar
Germany
10526
Rep
22,992
Posts

Drives: N54 e82
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Bayern, Germany

iTrader: (1)

Ohh boy! People will be going to JAIL over this scandal!!!



Reminds me of these TDi-gate bumper stickers...
Name:  VW Bumper sticker949.jpg
Views: 8717
Size:  54.7 KB

Name:  VW smoke  18821693-mmmain.jpg
Views: 8644
Size:  45.0 KB
Appreciate 3
      02-28-2017, 10:10 AM   #4
Quicksilv3r
Captain
Quicksilv3r's Avatar
United_States
234
Rep
878
Posts

Drives: 2013 BMW 535i M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Augusta, Georgia

iTrader: (1)

Of course they did. They've also known about their inferior rod bearings on pretty much every M engine built since 1998, but I suppose this only affects the life of the car, not the owner so no care.
__________________
-WJV
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 11:05 AM   #5
RACEM3_LV
Enlisted Member
RACEM3_LV's Avatar
4
Rep
34
Posts

Drives: BMW 328i, 17' YMB M3
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

iTrader: (0)

Good story, thanks for sharing my man!
__________________
17' YMB F80
14' GS F30

"If you can't handle me at my fastest, you don't deserve me at my furiousest"
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 11:35 AM   #6
The Automotive Enthusiast
Retired BMW Genius
The Automotive Enthusiast's Avatar
United_States
2895
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2018 Audi S5 Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: DMV

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
Ohh boy! People will be going to JAIL over this scandal!!!



Reminds me of these TDi-gate bumper stickers...
Attachment 1581225

Attachment 1581226
I'm interested to see how this plays out. Takata claims they have documents that prove their claim.
Appreciate 1
Dackelone10525.50
      02-28-2017, 11:40 AM   #7
IndotagSwizz
Major
IndotagSwizz's Avatar
525
Rep
1,231
Posts

Drives: F30 320i
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Miami

iTrader: (0)

this is the firestone thing all over again...
__________________
Appreciate 3
      02-28-2017, 12:31 PM   #8
Nar
Second Lieutenant
Nar's Avatar
United_States
83
Rep
291
Posts

Drives: 2016 BMW 340i 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Los Angeles, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2016 BMW 340i  [0.00]
I can't believe this whole Takata recall is still going on. Seems like it's never gonna end.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 12:40 PM   #9
zamboni
I want to drive a Zamboni
zamboni's Avatar
United_States
1128
Rep
5,554
Posts

Drives: 13 E93 M3 18 F80 M3 16 K71
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Monte Sereno, CA

iTrader: (7)

Garage List
16 K71 F800GT  [10.00]
2018 F80 M3  [10.00]
2013 BMW E93 M3  [10.00]
I received a recall notice for my M3 and dealer won't have the replacement airbag, what is my other option?
__________________
18 F80 Imola Red 6MT
16 K71 F800GT Montego Blue
13 E93 M3 Melbourne Red

2000 E46,2006 E90,09 E82,13 E93 328i,14 F30 335i,18 F80 M3
My next vehicle would be a Zamboni
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 12:48 PM   #10
MightyMouseTech
Major General
MightyMouseTech's Avatar
4338
Rep
6,196
Posts

Drives: 13 135i 6MT LeMans Blue MSport
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Ottawa, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nar View Post
I can't believe this whole Takata recall is still going on. Seems like it's never gonna end.
We have been dealing with this crap for over 10 years now at Honda.
Appreciate 1
Dackelone10525.50
      02-28-2017, 01:27 PM   #11
tc328
Lieutenant
363
Rep
532
Posts

Drives: 328
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: bstny

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2007 3  [0.00]
And they say airbags suppose to save lives
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 02:09 PM   #12
marcva
Captain
United_States
378
Rep
647
Posts

Drives: E36 M345
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Vienna, Virginia, USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by zamboni View Post
I received a recall notice for my M3 and dealer won't have the replacement airbag, what is my other option?
4 Pt harness and airbag delete?
Appreciate 2
zamboni1127.50
G30 B581546.50
      02-28-2017, 02:36 PM   #13
CanAutM3
General
CanAutM3's Avatar
Canada
21115
Rep
20,741
Posts

Drives: 2021 911 turbo
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by tc328 View Post
And they say airbags suppose to save lives
OK, so some 16 poor souls all around the world died due to a defective airbag (RIP), but how many actually got their life saved because of an airbag? Probably in the millions.

In no way do I condone the actions of Takata. Their actions are inacceptable, but from a probability standpoint, I still rather have an active airbag in my car, even if it has the very low risk of causing an injury when deploying.
__________________
Porsche 911 turbo 2021 992 GT Silver

Previous cars: M4cs 2019 F82 Limerock Grey / M4 2015 F82 Silverstone / M3 2008 E92 Silverstone / M3 2002 E46 Carbon Black

Last edited by CanAutM3; 02-28-2017 at 02:53 PM..
Appreciate 9
      02-28-2017, 04:38 PM   #14
3M TAPE
Banned
3M TAPE's Avatar
No_Country
350
Rep
1,225
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: States

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
4 Pt harness and airbag delete?
+1

I recommend Takata 4 point harness
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 04:46 PM   #15
Eagle1oh7
Lieutenant Colonel
Eagle1oh7's Avatar
United_States
287
Rep
1,710
Posts

Drives: '11 328i Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chula Vista CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by zamboni View Post
I received a recall notice for my M3 and dealer won't have the replacement airbag, what is my other option?
4 Pt harness and airbag delete?
+HANS device.
__________________
DONE: Seibon CF Hood, M3 Rep, MSport rear w/DD CF Diffuser, M3 Rep Skirts, Seibon CSL trunklid, Forgestar F14 18s w/Michelin PSS, Eisenmann catback, AA Headers, BPC Stage 2, Charcoal Delete+revMotor+AFE Drop In filter
FUTURE MODS: LED headlights, CF rooftop, M3 Suspension Conversion, Dinan CAI Mod
Appreciate 1
zamboni1127.50
      02-28-2017, 05:24 PM   #16
Herofmine
Captain
Herofmine's Avatar
United_States
413
Rep
816
Posts

Drives: E92M3, F10535i, 15 M5,340i,X5M
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Dallas

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2015 X5M  [10.00]
Then just unplug the airbag and put the 0.99c resister instated, no airbag light + safety)) lol
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 06:01 PM   #17
raysspl
Brigadier General
raysspl's Avatar
992
Rep
3,001
Posts

Drives: walking, bicycle, & bus
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (0)

Damn, I hope this gets rectified quickly
__________________
re
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 06:14 PM   #18
Destroya
Lieutenant
Destroya's Avatar
371
Rep
418
Posts

Drives: 2020 X2 M35i
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Oregon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
OK, so some 16 poor souls all around the world died due to a defective airbag (RIP), but how many actually got their life saved because of an airbag? Probably in the millions.

In no way do I condone the actions of Takata. Their actions are inacceptable, but from a probability standpoint, I still rather have an active airbag in my car, even if it has the very low risk of causing an injury when deploying.
Does it bother you that Takata relied on a cost/benefit analysis when deciding to proceed with airbags it knew were defective? Let's see, we may kill 20 people, at about 5M per settlement or $100M total, but it would cost a billion to admit the problem and fix them. Hmmm, what to do?
Appreciate 3
Alfisti6496.00
clbmw632.50
      02-28-2017, 07:05 PM   #19
The Automotive Enthusiast
Retired BMW Genius
The Automotive Enthusiast's Avatar
United_States
2895
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2018 Audi S5 Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: DMV

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Destroya View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
OK, so some 16 poor souls all around the world died due to a defective airbag (RIP), but how many actually got their life saved because of an airbag? Probably in the millions.

In no way do I condone the actions of Takata. Their actions are inacceptable, but from a probability standpoint, I still rather have an active airbag in my car, even if it has the very low risk of causing an injury when deploying.
Does it bother you that Takata relied on a cost/benefit analysis when deciding to proceed with airbags it knew were defective? Let's see, we may kill 20 people, at about 5M per settlement or $100M total, but it would cost a billion to admit the problem and fix them. Hmmm, what to do?
It comes down to having some morals, not the money.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucBroDude View Post
TRAITOR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucBroDude View Post
TRAITOR.
Appreciate 3
CanAutM321115.00
Dackelone10525.50
clbmw632.50
      02-28-2017, 08:51 PM   #20
Eagle1oh7
Lieutenant Colonel
Eagle1oh7's Avatar
United_States
287
Rep
1,710
Posts

Drives: '11 328i Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chula Vista CA

iTrader: (0)

Still waiting for my recall.?
__________________
DONE: Seibon CF Hood, M3 Rep, MSport rear w/DD CF Diffuser, M3 Rep Skirts, Seibon CSL trunklid, Forgestar F14 18s w/Michelin PSS, Eisenmann catback, AA Headers, BPC Stage 2, Charcoal Delete+revMotor+AFE Drop In filter
FUTURE MODS: LED headlights, CF rooftop, M3 Suspension Conversion, Dinan CAI Mod
Appreciate 0
      02-28-2017, 10:53 PM   #21
Teutonic
Colonel
Teutonic's Avatar
No_Country
2709
Rep
2,350
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle1oh7 View Post
Still waiting for my recall.?
Same in here. My letter is already over a year old if not more. I just called yesterday BMW Canada for a follow up and they don't know nothing.
Any ETA for parts, 2 months, 8 months another 3 years? They know NOTHING!

How is that for a customer care?
Appreciate 1
Igor_M52134.00
      02-28-2017, 11:12 PM   #22
mdai245
First Lieutenant
United_States
104
Rep
340
Posts

Drives: 440i XDrive
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: NJ

iTrader: (1)

I can see this story being taught as a case study in engineering ethics classes for decades to come
Appreciate 2
WI_Rob93.50
clbmw632.50
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:50 AM.




7post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST