Ferguson, MS: Wilson vs Brown

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

16 pages of staying on topic in OT was somewhat a success.

People are really quiet with the video link I posted recently because it can't be refuted.

In the article is says white guy died in custody... hahaha?

[JasonCSU]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

16 pages of staying on topic in OT was somewhat a success.

People are really quiet with the video link I posted recently because it can't be refuted.

I'm still curious what people think of the story I linked to above. No comments as of yet.

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by JasonCSU

I'm still curious what people think of the story I linked to above. No comments as of yet.

Please forward us to the link again. I must have missed it between all the gossip about reality TV shows.

[squishy]

Re-post video link

squishy will give you his opinions on it

[P1]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

There you have it folks, America is fucking screwed.


A Grand Jury Did Indict One Person Involved In Eric Garner's Killing -- The Man Who Filmed It




http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/1...n_6264746.html

Hahahahaha, this is amazing

[JasonCSU]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

Please forward us to the link again. I must have missed it between all the gossip about reality TV shows.

Originally Posted by squishy

Re-post video link

squishy will give you his opinions on it

Here you go.

http://kdvr.com/2014/11/24/denver-po...llegal-search/

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by JasonCSU

Here you go.

http://kdvr.com/2014/11/24/denver-po...llegal-search/

The cop stated he punched him 6 times with his head against the cement because he thought he had drugs in his mouth and didn't wan't him to choke on them.

Holy shit. This is so fucked, it's almost comical.

[Uber V8]

I'm just going to post this one more time in case anybody missed it:


http://www.kpho.com/story/25238969/c...spect-officers


Calling out: @kingofjericho @p1et @asap @billup @middleagedal MrTonka



So ALL of you guys are going to act like you didn't see this video clip?

Every single argument for not indicting Eric Garner holds no weight.

Here we have:

1. A man that resist arrest
2. Is aggressively attacking police officers with his hands
3. Is unpredictable
4. Could be reaching for cops guns (common argument used)

What the cops did not do:

1. Choke him
2. Shoot him to death

I'm curious if Eric Garner did the exact same things in this video, what would have happened? My guess is an instant unload of clips and a statement from cops saying we feared for our lives

[kevinbahnz]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

The cop stated he punched him 6 times with his head against the cement because he thought he had drugs in his mouth and didn't wan't him to choke on them.

Holy shit. This is so fucked, it's almost comical.

I thought he said , his partners arm was caught underneath the perps body and he was punching him in the face because he was afraid for his partners life.

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by kevinbahnz

I thought he said , his partners arm was caught underneath the perps body and he was punching him in the face because he was afraid for his partners life.

According to police reports, Jones’ reasoning for the punches were twofold:

1.) Trying to retrieve what he believed was a bag of heroin from the suspect’s mouth (and preventing Flores from choking)

2.)Fear that one of the other officer’s arms was injured after being trapped beneath the suspect’s body

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you just added that to what was reported.

[ragingclue]

I'm glad the eavesdropping law in IL was struck down.

[ASAP]

Just to be clear I left this thread at my final comment.

[MiddleAgedAl]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

I'm just going to post this one more time in case anybody missed it:


http://www.kpho.com/story/25238969/c...spect-officers


Calling out: @kingofjericho @p1et @asap @billup @middleagedal MrTonka



So ALL of you guys are going to act like you didn't see this video clip?

Every single argument for not indicting Eric Garner holds no weight.

Here we have:

1. A man that resist arrest
2. Is aggressively attacking police officers with his hands
3. Is unpredictable
4. Could be reaching for cops guns (common argument used)

What the cops did not do:

1. Choke him
2. Shoot him to death

I'm curious if Eric Garner did the exact same things in this video, what would have happened? My guess is an instant unload of clips and a statement from cops saying we feared for our lives

I'm really confused now. If I wanted to advance your position, this clip is not what I would use.

The parallels to Eric Garner are numerous, including the outcome to the suspect, and the lack of repercussion for the cops.

Crazy unpredictable suspect chooses to not act in his own best interest and ends up stone cold dead as a result of the police response (guy died later in hospital after being shot with stun gun, and physically restrained by multiple officers).

None of those officers where indicted either. In this case, the expired perp is the same race as the officers, so you cant say that using force to subdue a nutjob who cannot follow simple commands is the exclusive domain of a racist.

Yet another example of video proof that it's a really dumb idea to physically fight the law in that manner, instead of taking them to court later, where you at least have a chance of walking out with a pulse.

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by ASAP

oh my god, it has crown moldings lol

Originally Posted by ASAP

Just to be clear I left this thread at my final comment.

That's how you want to go out?

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

That's how you want to go out?

Word

[Billup]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

I'm curious if Eric Garner did the exact same things in this video, what would have happened? My guess is an instant unload of clips and a statement from cops saying we feared for our lives [/I]

What you fail to understand is the situational differences between the two. With your video, I think the cops were WAAYYYY too nice to that guy. They should have gotten him in a choke hold too.

I hardly believe any cop would have "unloaded a clip" into the guy. They would have subdued him in the exact same manner. These cops chose the "TASER" route, and look at how far it got them? Seriously?

Had they gotten him in a hold and took him to the ground, that whole fiasco could have ended sooner, and who knows, a white guy could have been dead.

[MiddleAgedAl]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

What the cops did not do:

1. Choke him
2. Shoot him to death

I'm curious if Eric Garner did the exact same things in this video, what would have happened? My guess is an instant unload of clips and a statement from cops saying we feared for our lives [/I]

Umm.... yes, the cops DID shoot him to death. It was a stun gun instead of a regular bullet with gunpowder, if you want to split hairs, but they zapped him at least 3 times, and the outcome is the same.

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by MiddleAgedAl

I'm really confused now. If I wanted to advance your position, this clip is not what I would use.

The parallels to Eric Garner are numerous, including the outcome to the suspect, and the lack of repercussion for the cops.

Crazy unpredictable suspect chooses to not act in his own best interest and ends up stone cold dead as a result of the police response (guy died later in hospital after being shot with stun gun, and physically restrained by multiple officers).

None of those officers where indicted either. In this case, the expired perp is the same race as the officers, so you cant say that using force to subdue a nutjob who cannot follow simple commands is the exclusive domain of a racist.

Yet another example of video proof that it's a really dumb idea to physically fight the law in that manner, instead of taking them to court later, where you at least have a chance of walking out with a pulse.

This is the exact clip I wanted to use so I used it.

First off, it was not reported that his cause of death was directly due to stun guns and physical restraint. It stated that he died later at the hospital while in custody.

That's not even the point that I'm trying to make. What I'm getting at is what I've highlighted in bold.

Why is this suspect not shot and killed immediately for his actions and threat towards the officers? They tased him three times and was still not able to remove the threat. Usually the next step is to shoot until threat is no longer a threat.

Why were the cops SO reluctant and doing everything in their power not to bring out their guns on this white man that has done exactly every "death sentence" worthy action that Mike Brown and Eric Garner has done?

Let me paint the picture more clear:

Mike brown (black guy) and officer Wilson (white guy) have an altercation = Result, 12 rounds shot at Mr. Brown killing him.

White guy (in this video) has an altercation with police officer = Result, fighting and fighting, then tasing and tasing, no guns ever drawn.

Eric Garner (black guy) resist arrest = Result, choked to death

White guy (in this video) resist arrest = Result; fighting and fighting, then tasing and tasing, no guns ever drawn

still confused?



That, is what I'm getting at.

[ragingclue]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

Why were the cops SO reluctant and doing everything in their power not to bring out their guns on this white man that has done exactly every "death sentence" worthy action that Mike Brown and Eric Garner has done?

Let me paint the picture more clear:

Mike brown (black guy) and officer Wilson (white guy) have an altercation = Result, 12 rounds shot at Mr. Brown killing him.

White guy (in this video) has an altercation with police officer = Result, fighting and fighting, then tasing and tasing, no guns ever drawn.

Yes we are confused. No offense, but the comparison is uncontrolled shit. I don't know if that's why nobody else answered, but it's why I didn't (not trying to be a dick although I know I'm a dick... you asked why nobody addressed it so here I am with my reason). Like was already posted, there are so many critical situational differences that it's mostly irrelevant. There are a few things we can discern from the comparison, namely that tasers are not non-lethal and so everybody who is screaming that they should have tased him is ignorant. There are a lot of other reasonable assumptions/conclusions that can be drawn, but none of what you were trying to get across. If anything, the video hurts your stance.

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by MiddleAgedAl

Umm.... yes, the cops DID shoot him to death. It was a stun gun instead of a regular bullet with gunpowder, if you want to split hairs, but they zapped him at least 3 times, and the outcome is the same.

No, and let's call everything straight up as it is, enough of this beating around the bush.

If I say "he was shot to death", most reasonable people will not think, he must be referring to a stun gun. They're going to think a firearm, pistol, shotgun, etc...

Now, since we're all going by the book on all of these cases and cited actual medical records, we have to be consistent and cite that his actual cause of death was due to stun guns.

I have no proof that stun guns killed or nor do I have proof that he was on an extreme drug overdose and was on his way out anyways, it simply doesn't matter.

What I'm getting at is why was this suspect not shot and killed or choked to death for being equal to or 10X more of a threat than the case of Mr. Brown and Mr. Garner? Is it because of his skin color?

Can you answer that?

[Uber V8]

Originally Posted by ragingclue

Yes we are confused. No offense, but the comparison is uncontrolled shit. I don't know if that's why nobody else answered, but it's why I didn't (not trying to be a dick although I know I'm a dick... you asked why nobody addressed it so here I am with my reason). Like was already posted, there are so many critical situational differences that it's mostly irrelevant. There are a few things we can discern from the comparison, namely that tasers are not non-lethal and so everybody who is screaming that they should have tased him is ignorant. There are a lot of other reasonable assumptions/conclusions that can be drawn, but none of what you were trying to get across. If anything, the video hurts your stance.

What. The. Fuck.

1st half of your reasoning is you explaining that your a dick, followed by the video is irrelevant, ended with there are a lot of other reasons/conclusions that can be drawn?

Bruh, I didn't tag you for a response for a reason and that shit you just said right there is the reason why. Go back to the general automotive non-BMW and talk about mustangs because you can't even muster up a respectable argument.

I see why you chose Raging Clue for your screen name, you don't seem to have one.

[MiddleAgedAl]

Originally Posted by FwdFtl

First off, it was not reported that his cause of death was directly due to stun guns and physical restraint. It stated that he died later at the hospital while in custody.

The suggestion that his death at the hospital a short time later was unrelated to the actions of the officers is absurd. C'mon man... really?

He was "showing signs of medical distress" at the scene, just like Garner did. I suppose the sudden-onset medical distress was unrelated to the cops actions too ?

Bottom line is that both suspects acted foolishly, both ended up dead as a result of the actions the cops were forced to make, and cops were not indicted in either case.

And I'd bet (but you probably not agree) that in both cases, the officers did not want to see the suspect dead. They used up their limited deployment of taser "zaps" (which cannot be discharged dozens of times in a row like a regular gun, you cant retract the cord, slap in a new battery and shoot again like swapping magazines of bullets)

So, with no other non-lethal force available, they waited until other cops arrived, and dog-piled on the guy to physically subdue him, just like the NYPD did. If the NYPD didnt have the sheer manpower advantage they did, the incident may have dragged out longer, and while the result would still be the same (Garner dead), it may not have appeared as though they were putting up with as much resistance as the Phoenix cops did.

But, I guess if you are determined to see race in something, you'll see it, whether it's there or not.