I am LIVID! (Rant)

[NYCGP]

I just left my management office in the apartment building I live in. On August 26th, 2010, I signed a one year lease renewal with a "Lease Rider" stating the following:

"The owner will allow early terminateion of the lease provided the tenant occupies said apartment for a minimum of five months and notifies Management in writing within sixty (60) days of intent to vacate."

Understanding this stipulation, I gave my notice in writing on December 15th, 2010. I stated I would be leaving at the end of February. I never received a response but I got a delivery receipt for the email. At the end of last month I stopped by the office to see if there was anything else they required of me before I moved out at the end of the month. They said they had no idea I was moving out and the women in charge had quit. I said, "No problem. I have confirmation, etc."

So I sent out all the info they requested. They haven't responded to me since the email was went on February 3rd. I checked my credit card bill today (I pay my rent using a CC. It is wonderfully convenient.), they charged me DOUBLE my normal charge for rent. When I got back to my building, I went straight to the management office and questioned the double charge and questioned why I have received no response in almost 2 weeks. His answer, "You have to stay through the end of March."

This is where things got really blurry. I completely lost my shit. They purposely double charged my CC rent for March, JUST IN CASE, I tried to leave. The guy I was speaking to said he was new and didn't know how everything worked, but I could contact this women tomorrow. I said, she can contact me, because I am canceling the charges RIGHT NOW. He also said that I misinterpreted the "Lease Rider". I have to stay for 5 months PLUS the 60 days. LIES. What I typed above is what the rider says verbatim.

I am so heated right now...

[solefald]

That's why I would *NEVER* do automated rent payments.

When I lived in Brooklyn many many many years ago, to move in, you had to pay the Super first month rent, last month rent plus another month rent as a bribe, for letting you move in. That shit was way too shady

[CollinsE90]

Should of rescheduled

[Slops]

Cancel the payment and move out. Tell them that you'll take them to court and fight this bullshit. I hate when people try to take advantage of you. One thing that you may have a hiccup on is the initial email... Even though you got a delivery confirmation, doesn't mean the right people read it and took action. One thing I would have done differently is to go directly to the office and hand deliver your notice. Any clarifications should have happened at that point. Good luck, and refuse to pay the double pay. Talk to your cc company and say it's an un-authorized payment.

[NYCGP]

Originally Posted by CollinsE90

Should of rescheduled

ok that made me smile... maybe I chuckled a bit too.

[NYCGP]

Originally Posted by Sloppy

Cancel the payment and move out. Tell them that you'll take them to court and fight this bullshit. I hate when people try to take advantage of you. One thing that you may have a hiccup on is the initial email... Even though you got a delivery confirmation, doesn't mean the right people read it and took action. One thing I would have done differently is to go directly to the office and hand deliver your notice. Any clarifications should have happened at that point. Good luck, and refuse to pay the double pay. Talk to your cc company and say it's an un-authorized payment.

Wouldn't accept a hand delivered. They instructed me to email this specific person. I showed up in the office earlier in December. They told me exactly what to do, and I did it.

[Wakka]

charge-back. I bet they wont be too happy about it... but fuck that shit

[Slops]

Originally Posted by NYCGP

Wouldn't accept a hand delivered. They instructed me to email this specific person. I showed up in the office earlier in December. They told me exactly what to do, and I did it.

Wow... That's some BS. I would simply tell them straight up you'll take them to court then. Send it to the same address with read confirmation!

[JayKay335i]

[NYCGP]

Originally Posted by JayKay335i

o...m...g.

[Augenbrauezug]

Originally Posted by NYCGP

"The owner will allow early terminateion of the lease provided the tenant occupies said apartment for a minimum of five months and notifies Management in writing within sixty (60) days of intent to vacate."

He also said that I misinterpreted the "Lease Rider". I have to stay for 5 months PLUS the 60 days. LIES. What I typed above is what the rider says verbatim.

Devil's advocate below, do not read if still heated:

It does sound like they intended you to occupy the apartment for 5 months before the notice to vacate. That being said, they should of worded it better. It would easily be argued in court, in your favor.

I HATE apartment management, most of the people that work in the finance department are total douche bags.

[lopealle]

shooting spree of the office building?

[JayKay335i]

Originally Posted by lopealle

shooting spree of the office building?

[ideliver]

Originally Posted by Augenbrauezug

Devil's advocate below, do not read if still heated:

It does sound like they intended you to occupy the apartment for 5 months before the notice to vacate.

this is how i read it...otherwise why have a one year lease??? so in reality you have a seven month lease...

[O-cha]

Written notification is the only way that stands up. If you certified mailed them it would be easy, but you didn't.

Want to be a real dick? Find stuff in your lease that is stipulated to be their job to maintain that they aren't. You can do things like withhold rent or even straight brake a lease that way. Read your state tenant landlord laws.

[ErvGotti]

I think they might have you, the way I read it is if you signed on the 26th of Aug then the 26th of Sept would be one month. So 26th of Jan would be the mandatory five months plus the 60 days would put you legally able to move out on the 26th of March. Basically you have to pay the month of March, you can get it pro rated for the 26 days instead of the full 30.

Since you signed at the end of the month, that you cant count Aug as one month. So Sept 26 would be the first month and Jan 26 would be the mandatory five and Mar 26 would be the 60 days notice time or date you can move out.

Either way Good luck with everything, I know how much it sucks trying to move out at times.

[Spoolin335]

I wouldnt worry to much, i would just cancel the charge.
A contract is a contract. Both parties need to abide by it.

Good thing you have confirmation on your email. That is going to be very valuable if they do pursue any legal action.

[schoy]

Originally Posted by ideliver

this is how i read it...otherwise why have a one year lease??? so in reality you have a seven month lease...

Disagree. Plain interpretation yields thusly --
Owner will allow termination if the following 2 conditions are met:
1) Tenant occupies apartment for at least 5 months; and
2) Tenant provides written notice of intent to vacate within 60 days.

No way this could be interpreted to be a minimum 7 month lease (to do so, additional language would have to be added that the notice could not be given until after the 5 months are up; I'm assuming no such language exists). It sounds like the OP met both requirements, and hence is in the right.

Caveat: One thing that is ambiguous is when notice is required to be given. The lease rider language says "within 60 days". Does that mean "at least" or "no more than" 60 days? A plausible interpretation is "no more than", meaning that a tenant could give 1 day notice and still satisfy that notice requirement.

[NYCGP]

Originally Posted by schoy

Disagree. Plain interpretation yields thusly --
Owner will allow termination if the following 2 conditions are met:
1) Tenant occupies apartment for at least 5 months; and
2) Tenant provides written notice of intent to vacate within 60 days.

No way this could be interpreted to be a minimum 7 month lease (to do so, additional language would have to be added that the notice could not be given until after the 5 months are up; I'm assuming no such language exists). It sounds like the OP met both requirements, and hence is in the right.

Caveat: One thing that is ambiguous is when notice is required to be given. The lease rider language says "within 60 days". Does that mean "at least" or "no more than" 60 days? A plausible interpretation is "no more than", meaning that a tenant could give 1 day notice and still satisfy that notice requirement.

Thank you. I even ran it by my Real Estate attorney. He said the same thing. There was only one interpretation for what they wrote. It is missing "in addition to" or any other connection that would make it 7 months. They stated I was required to live in the apartment for 5 months. I lived in it for 6.

[bolinp78]

That lease provision is written in a very unclear manner, which might have been their intent. There are so many better ways that it could have been written.

The word "and" in the middle COULD be interpreted to mean that the two events (occupying the apartment for 5 months and giving 60 day notice) must be performed in chronology, but in my opinion it is far too ambiguous to pin down.

I don't believe anything good will happen if you take them to court because this provision could be interpreted a few different ways very easily. I guess you probably wouldn't have to anyway since you paid with a CC

[Maestro]

I was going to saying the same thing about how they wrote the language, it is vague enough to allow them to interrupt how they want. However, in most states the laws generally favor the tenant over the landlord. Therefore, if you challenged it you would win, court do not like double talk in contracts like this.

The other thing I usually do with things like this and for your future reference is put a time clause in the letter. You simply put a statement at the end of your letter that says unless you hear otherwise from them within a period of time like two weeks or 30 days then you will take their non response as acceptance of what you stated in the letter. This put the responsibility on them to get back to you if what you are asking is not okay with them. No response mean they approve.

[Blake]

either way, dispute the charges with your CC and say you were double charged and the merchant can't be reached to correct the charges.