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      01-16-2020, 11:38 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by ShocknAwe View Post
This is exactly what I mean. 997.2 is amazing. Thought about getting one earlier this year but bruh, I don't have space for 3 cars.
I enjoy driving the Cayman more than the water cooled 911's. They're just slightly more involving and direct. I don't think you could go wrong with either, but one of the simple reasons I don't have a 997 is that my lazy self likes the tech on newer cars, so a 982.2 GTS would be about perfect.
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      01-16-2020, 12:00 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Dormermike View Post
Lovely to see nasp engines still available.

I thought turbo was for emissions but presumably they can still hit those targets without a turbo.
Modern turbos are better IMO, but require more expensive materials and design, especially to be reliable. Itís far from impossible. The benefit is crazy torque down low, 1500-1700 full torque to redline. That will give you far more seat of the pants (and real) acceleration. Noise makes you think you are going fast, but the reality can be different than the noise indicates.
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      01-16-2020, 01:01 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes View Post
Modern turbos are better IMO, but require more expensive materials and design, especially to be reliable. It’s far from impossible. The benefit is crazy torque down low, 1500-1700 full torque to redline. That will give you far more seat of the pants (and real) acceleration. Noise makes you think you are going fast, but the reality can be different than the noise indicates.
Meh. F1 races suck these days. Cars sound truly awful. I'd take an AM Valkyrie over any turbo charged super car just for the sound.
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      01-16-2020, 02:15 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
I enjoy driving the Cayman more than the water cooled 911's. They're just slightly more involving and direct. I don't think you could go wrong with either, but one of the simple reasons I don't have a 997 is that my lazy self likes the tech on newer cars, so a 982.2 GTS would be about perfect.
Whatever I can get that is as stripped to basics as I can get is good. I hate the fancy nav and infotainment systems, especially Porsche PCM. Can't keep it up to date.

Sorry. Way off topic.

I will need to get out and drive one of these new 4.0 Caymans when they show up locally. Can't wait.
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      01-16-2020, 02:27 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by ShocknAwe View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
I enjoy driving the Cayman more than the water cooled 911's. They're just slightly more involving and direct. I don't think you could go wrong with either, but one of the simple reasons I don't have a 997 is that my lazy self likes the tech on newer cars, so a 982.2 GTS would be about perfect.
Whatever I can get that is as stripped to basics as I can get is good. I hate the fancy nav and infotainment systems, especially Porsche PCM. Can't keep it up to date.

Sorry. Way off topic.

I will need to get out and drive one of these new 4.0 Caymans when they show up locally. Can't wait.
I'd love to see these flat-sixes make their way into the Cayman and Boxster T.
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      01-16-2020, 02:43 PM   #28
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that's great news

glad Porsche are listening to the customer base and giving the enthusiasts what they want. turbo cars are great, but i'd rather have a more responsive throttle and less turbo lag... even if that means giving up some low end torque.
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      01-16-2020, 08:44 PM   #29
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that's great news

glad Porsche are listening to the customer base and giving the enthusiasts what they want. turbo cars are great, but i'd rather have a more responsive throttle and less turbo lag... even if that means giving up some low end torque.
Sure but get real. How many "folks" do Porsche owners represent globally? Its a niche crowd. Cayman and Boxster GTS going NA doesn't signal any global trend whatsoever. Porsche and Porsche owners with NA, MT mid and rear engines are now more the outliers than ever.
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      01-16-2020, 09:56 PM   #30
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Sure but get real. How many "folks" do Porsche owners represent globally? Its a niche crowd. Cayman and Boxster GTS going NA doesn't signal any global trend whatsoever. Porsche and Porsche owners with NA, MT mid and rear engines are now more the outliers than ever.
Doesn't the Macan outsell the sports cars combined? Add in the Cayenne and Panamera and you don't have anything with a manual or under two tons.

There's a guy who lives near me with a Cayenne Turbo Hybrid S that thinks it's a 918.
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      01-16-2020, 10:08 PM   #31
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Doesn't the Macan outsell the sports cars combined?
Its still considerably a low volume vehicle. They sell only less than 25k Macans a year, while BMW, Mercedes and Audi sell close to 80k of their compact SUVs (if you include the coupe version as well). Although I'd imagine Porsche maybe makes a bigger profit due to the higher prices and long options list. The SUVs are what provide Porsche with the funds to build their awesome sports cars, and really saved the brand years ago.
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      01-16-2020, 10:11 PM   #32
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Its still considerably a low volume vehicle. They sell only less than 25k Macans a year, while BMW, Mercedes and Audi sell close to 80k of their compact SUVs (if you include the coupe version as well). Although I'd imagine Porsche maybe makes a bigger profit due to the higher prices and long options list. The SUVs are what provide Porsche with the funds to build their awesome sports cars, and really saved the brand years ago.
Oh, I know. I was messing around with the Macan GTS configurator this week and hit $35k in options without even really trying.
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      01-16-2020, 10:19 PM   #33
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This is more a function of Porsche listening to their sales figures. The 718 numbers have been terrible since the introduction of the 4 cylinder mill.

It's a real shame. The chassis could handle much more power, but then it would poach sales from the 911.
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      01-17-2020, 07:29 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Lucky1 View Post
Sure but get real. How many "folks" do Porsche owners represent globally? Its a niche crowd. Cayman and Boxster GTS going NA doesn't signal any global trend whatsoever. Porsche and Porsche owners with NA, MT mid and rear engines are now more the outliers than ever.
Doesn't the Macan outsell the sports cars combined? Add in the Cayenne and Panamera and you don't have anything with a manual or under two tons.

There's a guy who lives near me with a Cayenne Turbo Hybrid S that thinks it's a 918.
Do Macan and Cayenne owners care if their engines are 6 cylinder NA vs 4 cylinder turbo and mated to a 6SPD? Doubt it.
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      01-17-2020, 07:33 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by JDC PDX View Post
This is more a function of Porsche listening to their sales figures. The 718 numbers have been terrible since the introduction of the 4 cylinder mill.

It's a real shame. The chassis could handle much more power, but then it would poach sales from the 911.
Such is the story of the Cayman/Boxster vs 911 relationship in the Porsche lineup. With this decision though the Boxster and Cayman now have as many cylinders as the 911 again, more displacement and nearly as much power as my 991.1 C4S. Probably better performance. I kind of feel insecure now

Great options for sports car lovers. Porsche continues to listen to customers and have won my devotion and money! When I can earn enough though...the price tag on their cars is becoming completely unreal
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      01-17-2020, 07:39 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Lucky1 View Post
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Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
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Originally Posted by Lucky1 View Post
Sure but get real. How many "folks" do Porsche owners represent globally? Its a niche crowd. Cayman and Boxster GTS going NA doesn't signal any global trend whatsoever. Porsche and Porsche owners with NA, MT mid and rear engines are now more the outliers than ever.
Doesn't the Macan outsell the sports cars combined? Add in the Cayenne and Panamera and you don't have anything with a manual or under two tons.

There's a guy who lives near me with a Cayenne Turbo Hybrid S that thinks it's a 918.
Do Macan and Cayenne owners care if their engines are 6 cylinder NA vs 4 cylinder turbo and mated to a 6SPD? Doubt it.
Oh, they do. There are probably a dozen worldwide buyers who'd want an N/A SUV. The rest want torque and more torque. The Model Y will rule this market just like the Model 3 swept the floor with German sedans.
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      01-17-2020, 08:24 AM   #37
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It was about damn time. Finally 90k gets you a modern Porsche sportscar with a NA engine that still isn't able to crack 100hp/liter in 2020...

It's certainly less lame than the 4 cylinder shit they've been peddling the past few years on the Cayman
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      01-17-2020, 08:26 AM   #38
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Oh, they do. There are probably a dozen worldwide buyers who'd want an N/A SUV. The rest want torque and more torque. The Model Y will rule this market just like the Model 3 swept the floor with German sedans.
Not so sure, yes off roaders want torque but I'm not sure they are the types that are going to jump on the EV bandwagon. Time will tell I guess.
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      01-17-2020, 10:10 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Oh, they do. There are probably a dozen worldwide buyers who'd want an N/A SUV. The rest want torque and more torque. The Model Y will rule this market just like the Model 3 swept the floor with German sedans.
Not so sure, yes off roaders want torque but I'm not sure they are the types that are going to jump on the EV bandwagon. Time will tell I guess.
Wait, what off-roaders? No one driving a German SUV takes it off road. They're grocery getters.
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      01-17-2020, 10:19 AM   #40
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I am a big Porsche fan. As time goes on, its such a shame that they have to make sure the mid-engine platform is inferior in every measurable way to the rear-engine platform.
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      01-17-2020, 10:21 AM   #41
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Wait, what off-roaders? No one driving a German SUV takes it off road. They're grocery getters.
Indeed, they are just modern station wagons without the stigma. Jeep Wranglers and Ford Raptors hardly ever go off road.
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      01-17-2020, 04:30 PM   #42
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$10k more for a 6 cylinder thatís slower then the turbo 4 and wonít even offer PDK? No thanks.
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      01-17-2020, 04:38 PM   #43
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$10k more for a 6 cylinder thatís slower then the turbo 4 and wonít even offer PDK? No thanks.
I'm going to suggest that the flat 6 manual will hold it's value better than the dyson.
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      01-17-2020, 05:49 PM   #44
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I'm going to suggest that the flat 6 manual will hold it's value better than the dyson.
So youíre saying I can buy the faster turbo 4 GTS for a heavy discount.
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