In person look at BMW i7 in Tanzanite Blue Metallic

[mpop302]

Originally Posted by DocWeatherington

The question is what are the worldwide sales as the US market isn't the driver for all luxury cars anymore. Certain models are more suited to US tastes and others are not.

The US only makes up 4-5 % of the worlds population all be it we are amongst the wealthest nations.

Luxury sedans aren't our market it's SUVs and Trucks lol

Agreed but I’d argue that the x7 (big suv is as American as it gets) has the same design language

[mpop302]

I find the aggressive front of this car to be very conflicting with subtle rear. Design doesn’t flow to me. And we shouldn’t have to say “oh but at least it looks good in black.”

Imo Genesis designed the dual light theme 10 fold better than bmw. That looks luxury, the new 7 looks like a jeep or a Kona

Design combined with how quickly these tank in value will make a really hard sell in the US

[jwr0721]

None of BMW's design language makes sense anymore. It's like they're writing English using Cyrillic letters. So bizarre. So horrendously ugly. As if it's ugly for the sake of ugly.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by mpop302

I find the aggressive front of this car to be very conflicting with subtle rear. Design doesn’t flow to me. And we shouldn’t have to say “oh but at least it looks good in black.”

Imo Genesis designed the dual light theme 10 fold better than bmw. That looks luxury, the new 7 looks like a jeep or a Kona

Design combined with how quickly these tank in value will make a really hard sell in the US

Who knows time will tell.

When the E65 was introduced 20 years ago, many hated it and predicted its quick demise. However, the E65 went in to become the best selling 7 Series BMW of all time…

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by jwr0721

None of BMW's design language makes sense anymore. It's like they're writing English using Cyrillic letters. So bizarre. So horrendously ugly. As if it's ugly for the sake of ugly.

There are other brands whose more restrained and flowing design language will suit you better. Remember they are chasing a different customer demographic with this controversial car and it is not you and me.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by mpop302

Agreed but I’d argue that the x7 (big suv is as American as it gets) has the same design language

Yes and no for the X7. That SUV is big, squared off, monolithic and imposing. The design language works best on this type of vehicle IMHO.

[jwr0721]

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

There are other brands whose more restrained and flowing design language will suit you better. Remember they are chasing a different customer demographic with this controversial car and it is not you and me.

I've just decided to drive the BMWs I like … it's just that they're all 20 years old now. Lol

[silverstar335]

Originally Posted by roho3323

Tesla Model S is nowhere near the same class outside of price, It's a 5 series, A6, E class, competitor.

Numbers:

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by silverstar335

Numbers:

It is amazing to me, how the once sought after Audi A6 has become a foot note in history. Not even the 2018 redesign helped this car take the sales fight to its main rivals, the MB E-Class and BMW 5 series.

20 years ago, Audi A6 sedans were incredibly popular.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by jwr0721

I've just decided to drive the BMWs I like … it's just that they're all 20 years old now. Lol

Exactly.

You the BMW core customer of yesteryear has been left out. For you only E-Chassis BMWs from 20+ years ago will do.
And that is fine BTW.

BMW took a sharp turn back in 2002. Today their mission, goals and product focus is completely different of what it was before then.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by silverstar335

Some numbers:

Those stats are true but misleading. A lot of those sales losses are due to SUVs and not Tesla and/or Electric cars


I’ve been harping on them for years and I’ll continue to do so - electric cars are NOT suited for consumer or commercial use. Besides their limited shelf life, (batteries will degrade over time, charging time and capacity will get less) they are EXPENSIVE and will only get more expensive as BEV production ramps up - they aren’t as convenient, are heavy and outside of sound bites of ‘looks like the future’ do nothing better.

Everyone who talks about BEVS always talks about the future instead of the present because the realities of these vehicles is they aren’t suited for everyday use over a Gas powered car. It’s going to be a 150k paperweight in 7 years when the next owners don’t want to invest in a new battery back (expect 20k plus) to keep the car running.

This car is no exception and is a terrible answer to a question no one asked. I’m sure people will buy it because they have the means and want to keep up with appearances, but let’s just be honest.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

Those stats are true but misleading. A lot of those sales losses are due to SUVs and not Tesla and/or Electric cars


I've been harping on them for years and I'll continue to do so - electric cars are NOT suited for consumer or commercial use. Besides their limited shelf life, (batteries will degrade over time, charging time and capacity will get less) they are EXPENSIVE and will only get more expensive as BEV production ramps up - they aren't as convenient, are heavy and outside of sound bites of 'looks like the future' do nothing better.

Everyone who talks about BEVS always talks about the future instead of the present because the realities of these vehicles is they aren't suited for everyday use over a Gas powered car. It's going to be a 150k paperweight in 7 years when the next owners don't want to invest in a new battery back (expect 20k plus) to keep the car running.

This car is no exception and is a terrible answer to a question no one asked. I'm sure people will buy it because they have the means and want to keep up with appearances, but let's just be honest.

Legacy car manufacturers have no choice but to jump on the EV bandwagon. Be it regulatory, government, environmental, customer expectations or a combination of all, the industry is under tremendous pressure to enter this space. Suppose that Tesla had been unsuccessful in commercializing electric vehicles back in 2012, surely here in 2022 the Toyota Prius would have still been lauded as the technological achievement of the 21 century. Alas, Tesla succeeded in the game and paved the way for others to follow.

Agreed on most of your points. BEV are
Still very expensive and impractical for large swaths of the general population. The vast US/North American geography makes them the less desirable choice for any meaningful long distance driving. Challenges posed by very cold winters in parts of the continent reduce their range and effectiveness. Battery technology is still not quite there. BEV battery manufacturing comes at a fairly substantial environmental and human cost.

Then there is the less discussed aspects of EV and lithium battery safety considerations.
Lithium battery fires are no joke and potentially fatal events. Also no one has studied the extent on which occupants of EV vehicles are exposed to high levels of electromagnetic fields, more so than in modern ICE vehicles. What effects overtime in the human body and organs these electromagnetic fields would have on those who drive these vehicles day after day, year after year?

Outside of Tesla, charging networks are
Not well developed and our electrical grid requires substantial infrastructure improvements to support a scenario where every American now owns an EV vehicle.

So yes, ICE vehicles still have their place and reason to exist for the next few decades. At least BMW develops ICE, ICE/Hybrid and EV for their new platforms. I believe that is the right strategy. Unlike Tesla that has placed all of their golden eggs on the EV basket. Tesla doesn't have the capacity to produce a Model S with ICE or ICE/Hybrid unlike legacy manufactures for whom EV is yet another product channel, not the main meat and potatoes of the operation.

[hiki08]

Originally Posted by DK__LA

This looks like a car a Chinese brand would release to compete with BMW.

Actually... this does remind me of the Hongqi H9 and vice versa. They are a bit different when looked at side by side, but the way those upper headlights are shaped and the tall grille seem to have some resemblance.

As does the LCI X7 against the Hongqi E-HS9.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by hiki08

Actually... this does remind me of the Hongqi H9 and vice versa. They are a bit different when looked at side by side, but the way those upper headlights are shaped and the tall grille seem to have some resemblance.

As does the LCI X7 against the Hongqi E-HS9.

It is evident to anyone with a bit of industry knowledge that this vehicle was designed and tailored for its main market: China.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

It is amazing to me, how the once sought after Audi A6 has become a foot note in history. Not even the 2018 redesign helped this car take the sales fight to its main rivals, the MB E-Class and BMW 5 series.

20 years ago, Audi A6 sedans were incredibly popular.

The refresh was reflected in the 2019 model year which grew based on the chart, it just so happened to then go back down as 2020 is an anomaly year thanks to covid and its effects on dealerships and car sales.

The Audi has always kind of been a footnote, it was never going to reach the 5 or E in sales. Audi's in general sell less than their competitors from MB or BMW except for a model here or there such as the Q3 and Q5. The A8 for example is a very low seller, with the S-Class outselling it by 5-7 times the amount and the 7er usually 2-4 times.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

The refresh was reflected in the 2019 model year which grew based on the chart, it just so happened to then go back down as 2020 is an anomaly year thanks to covid and its effects on dealerships and car sales.

The Audi has always kind of been a footnote, it was never going to reach the 5 or E in sales. Audi's in general sell less than their competitors from MB or BMW except for a model here or there such as the Q3 and Q5. The A8 for example is a very low seller, with the S-Class outselling it by 5-7 times the amount and the 7er usually 2-4 times.

Yes I stand corrected.

Current A6 was launched in 2019. The Audi is typically 2 years behind the production cycle of the E-Class and 5-Series, both of which, will be introducing new generations of their respective vehicles around this time next year.

[mpop302]

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

It is evident to anyone with a bit of industry knowledge that this vehicle was designed and tailored for its main market: China.

BINGO

[silverstar335]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

Those stats are true but misleading. A lot of those sales losses are due to SUVs and not Tesla and/or Electric cars


I've been harping on them for years and I'll continue to do so - electric cars are NOT suited for consumer or commercial use. Besides their limited shelf life, (batteries will degrade over time, charging time and capacity will get less) they are EXPENSIVE and will only get more expensive as BEV production ramps up - they aren't as convenient, are heavy and outside of sound bites of 'looks like the future' do nothing better.

Everyone who talks about BEVS always talks about the future instead of the present because the realities of these vehicles is they aren't suited for everyday use over a Gas powered car. It's going to be a 150k paperweight in 7 years when the next owners don't want to invest in a new battery back (expect 20k plus) to keep the car running.

This car is no exception and is a terrible answer to a question no one asked. I'm sure people will buy it because they have the means and want to keep up with appearances, but let's just be honest.

These numbers are intended to provide some additional context in regard to that specific car segment. They clearly show that the appeal of the 7-series and market share here in the US over the years have certainly declined, whatever the reason may be. I think the new 7-series/i7 will certainly not reverse that trend, it could potentially accelerate it.

It would be rather disappointing if the next generation X5 inherits some of the same design features we are starting to see in the new 7-series/i7/X7.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

Legacy car manufacturers have no choice but to jump on the EV bandwagon. Be it regulatory, government, environmental, customer expectations or a combination of all, the industry is under tremendous pressure to enter this space. Suppose that Tesla had been unsuccessful in commercializing electric vehicles back in 2012, surely here in 2022 the Toyota Prius would have still been lauded as the technological achievement of the 21 century. Alas, Tesla succeeded in the game and paved the way for others to follow.

Succeeded on collecting money from tax payers to prop up Elon, and sell garbage quality cars. But that’s what marketing does, convinces people to make irrational choices.

But there is no real demand for EVs, all the talk I see is coming from the media and fake tech/car blogs that pop up over night telling people this is what they NEED without actually talking about the compromises that are necessary to own one, or true ownership experiences.

It’s literally marketing.

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

Agreed on most of your points. BEV are
Still very expensive and impractical for large swaths of the general population. The vast US/North American geography makes them the less desirable choice for any meaningful long distance driving. Challenges posed by very cold winters in parts of the continent reduce their range and effectiveness. Battery technology is still not quite there. BEV battery manufacturing comes at a fairly substantial environmental and human cost.

Then there is the less discussed aspects of EV and lithium battery safety considerations.
Lithium battery fires are no joke and potentially fatal events. Also no one has studied the extent on which occupants of EV vehicles are exposed to high levels of electromagnetic fields, more so than in modern ICE vehicles. What effects overtime in the human body and organs these electromagnetic fields would have on those who drive these vehicles day after day, year after year?

Yes!!! Thank you!!

Originally Posted by 530iDriver

Outside of Tesla, charging networks are
Not well developed and our electrical grid requires substantial infrastructure improvements to support a scenario where every American now owns an EV vehicle.

So yes, ICE vehicles still have their place and reason to exist for the next few decades. At least BMW develops ICE, ICE/Hybrid and EV for their new platforms. I believe that is the right strategy. Unlike Tesla that has placed all of their golden eggs on the EV basket. Tesla doesn't have the capacity to produce a Model S with ICE or ICE/Hybrid unlike legacy manufactures for whom EV is yet another product channel, not the main meat and potatoes of the operation.

Exactly and I agree. I honestly think Hybrids and Hydrogen are the way forward, but the media has already chosen their preferred propulsion.

[iamvanja]

Originally Posted by oz555

I like it. It looks important, expensive and mean.

Asking for a friend, falling asleep look looks… mean?

[Robert]

Originally Posted by mpop302

BINGO

Ok, please shed light on what part of new 7 series design DNA tailor to Chinese market?

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

Succeeded on collecting money from tax payers to prop up Elon, and sell garbage quality cars. But that’s what marketing does, convinces people to make irrational choices.

But there is no real demand for EVs, all the talk I see is coming from the media and fake tech/car blogs that pop up over night telling people this is what they NEED without actually talking about the compromises that are necessary to own one, or true ownership experiences.

It’s literally marketing.

Yes!!! Thank you!!

Exactly and I agree. I honestly think Hybrids and Hydrogen are the way forward, but the media has already chosen their preferred propulsion.

Originally Posted by mpop302

BINGO

BMW has been exploring Hydrogen propulsion for the better part of 2 decades.

Here is a recent YT video of a hydrogen iX5 being tested in Scandinavia: