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      05-13-2022, 02:16 PM   #1
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Is The 7 SERIES BMW's Saving Grace? Thoughts from Frank Stephenson

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Frank Stephenson shares his thoughts on the 7er.

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      05-13-2022, 03:33 PM   #2
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Not perfect... but not so bad!

I like it!
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      05-15-2022, 12:13 PM   #3
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Good analysis. I think I'm warming up to the design in areas. I'll never come around on the headlight situation, and overall how chunky the car looks, but unlike some other efforts recently I do see a lot of proper BMW lines and characteristics in this car.

Interior has been a 10/10 since day one for me. Just blows everything on the market out of the water.

Overall this is a strong effort and proper step forward for BMW. The past two generations of 7-series have been too conservative/predictable in my opinion. The G11's interior was especially underwhelming and "safe" from day one. This car actually feels a bit revolutionary inside and out.
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      05-23-2022, 07:48 AM   #4
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      05-24-2022, 11:46 AM   #5
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Not sure who this guy is and I haven't watched the video yet, but I like the looks of this car.

It has the presence the F01 had but the G11s lacked, and I'm glad it's a bit chunky, looks more luxury oriented than most anything else this side of $150k

Also the monolithic design language suits a car of this class so well. I'm glad theyre going with new design languages for their smaller cars and trying new things out; HUGE turnaround from the ugly F30/F10/F01 days where everything looked too alike. This isn't Audi/Mercedes!
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      05-24-2022, 11:48 AM   #6
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I think this car needs to be black to work.
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      05-24-2022, 11:51 AM   #7
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Blacked out, I think it looks gangster af.
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      05-24-2022, 12:13 PM   #8
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I will definitely go take a look at one when they arrive at the dealership. I think it will be a hit though. I hope the front has a massive feel when viewed in real life. Hard for me to tell in the videos and pictures.

I do think the darker colors look better, but again will have to see in real life. I will add I also prefer the competition's cars in darker paints.
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      05-24-2022, 12:18 PM   #9
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Ultimately these are cars I don't own and never wish to own. It doesn't excite me to see my favorite brands design language go to complete comedy but it is what it is. The difference between this new design language and bengals back in the day was that this is just redesign for the sake of doing it. There's no forward flow that reflects the past cars.

There is no longer range cohesiveness. The 3 doesn't look like the 5 like the 7 etc. which cheapens the brand a lot. The F30/F10/F01 for example is exactly what I'm talking about. They all look like bmws. And the higher range cars look like more premium versions of the other.

I say a lot on these forums and owners of cars like the G8X get annoyed at me because it rubs them the wrong way that I don't like a car they spent 80k on but I can assure you as someone in many different car communities online and in the real world, most people do not take to these new designs well at all. The current gen 4 and M3/4 which have been around for a while now are still negatively looked at. The best comments I see are "it looks ok in black." Well You should have to get a car in black with black accents to just hide the design language entirely to make it "ok" to look at. The non m sport versions of these cars are especially hideous and there's subtle things about the new 7 that are just pointless in design. It's not even the grille either because for the record, I didn't mind the facelifted G11 grille. Because the rest of the car actually looked like the car it replaced.

TL;DR- new bmws are insanely impressive on the road as drivers cars but horrible to look at.

End rant
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      05-24-2022, 12:46 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turkish Pickle View Post
Not sure who this guy is and I haven't watched the video yet, but I like the looks of this car.
Well respected car designer - of the original X5 and other cars.

Launched in South Korea, looking good.

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      05-24-2022, 01:15 PM   #11
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While I do agree with him that this is BMW's most cohesive effort at a car design lately, I still think the front end just doesn't match the overall design as the side and rear are very understated and decluttered compared to the bold and brash front end.
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      05-24-2022, 02:58 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123 View Post
Ultimately these are cars I don't own and never wish to own. It doesn't excite me to see my favorite brands design language go to complete comedy but it is what it is. The difference between this new design language and bengals back in the day was that this is just redesign for the sake of doing it. There's no forward flow that reflects the past cars.

There is no longer range cohesiveness. The 3 doesn't look like the 5 like the 7 etc. which cheapens the brand a lot. The F30/F10/F01 for example is exactly what I'm talking about. They all look like bmws. And the higher range cars look like more premium versions of the other.

I say a lot on these forums and owners of cars like the G8X get annoyed at me because it rubs them the wrong way that I don't like a car they spent 80k on but I can assure you as someone in many different car communities online and in the real world, most people do not take to these new designs well at all. The current gen 4 and M3/4 which have been around for a while now are still negatively looked at. The best comments I see are "it looks ok in black." Well You should have to get a car in black with black accents to just hide the design language entirely to make it "ok" to look at. The non m sport versions of these cars are especially hideous and there's subtle things about the new 7 that are just pointless in design. It's not even the grille either because for the record, I didn't mind the facelifted G11 grille. Because the rest of the car actually looked like the car it replaced.

TL;DR- new bmws are insanely impressive on the road as drivers cars but horrible to look at.

End rant
I think the M3/4/M4 are getting more normalized. I keep hearing anecdotally that people are getting used to it.

There's definitely going to be some backlash whenever a new design comes out, that's almost a given.

I don't know why you would want a 7-Series to look like a 3-Series. Brand cohesiveness is one thing, but outright confusion is another. I get the previous generation C/E/S-Class confused regularly.

I think BMW is doing the right thing by having it's ultra-luxury and more-sporty models have a different look. If a person wanted a blend-in "normal" looking car, they'd get a 3 or a 5 (or an Audi A8!). If you get a 7 or a 4, you're probably looking for something different, so BMW's designs reflect that.
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      05-24-2022, 03:34 PM   #13
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That's exactly their reasoning - according to their research 2/3 of BMW customers want the "normal" looking cars, so they cater them with the 3 and 5, X3, X5, X7. The 1/3 wants something more daring, that's where the vertical and large snouts some in.
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      05-24-2022, 03:42 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123 View Post
Ultimately these are cars I don't own and never wish to own. It doesn't excite me to see my favorite brands design language go to complete comedy but it is what it is. The difference between this new design language and bengals back in the day was that this is just redesign for the sake of doing it. There's no forward flow that reflects the past cars.

There is no longer range cohesiveness. The 3 doesn't look like the 5 like the 7 etc. which cheapens the brand a lot. The F30/F10/F01 for example is exactly what I'm talking about. They all look like bmws. And the higher range cars look like more premium versions of the other.

I say a lot on these forums and owners of cars like the G8X get annoyed at me because it rubs them the wrong way that I don't like a car they spent 80k on but I can assure you as someone in many different car communities online and in the real world, most people do not take to these new designs well at all. The current gen 4 and M3/4 which have been around for a while now are still negatively looked at. The best comments I see are "it looks ok in black." Well You should have to get a car in black with black accents to just hide the design language entirely to make it "ok" to look at. The non m sport versions of these cars are especially hideous and there's subtle things about the new 7 that are just pointless in design. It's not even the grille either because for the record, I didn't mind the facelifted G11 grille. Because the rest of the car actually looked like the car it replaced.

TL;DR- new bmws are insanely impressive on the road as drivers cars but horrible to look at.

End rant
I dunno, current 3 and 5 look pretty similar I think, especially the 3 LCI.

I get there are people who appreciate more conservative designs but I’m glad they continue to take risks and try new things. I’ve said many times that the ugly BMWs are my favorites. We currently have an i3s, Z4M, X7, and G82. They’re all strange in so many great ways imo. To have that sort individual personality while still driving like a BMW is a lot of fun to me. In any case, there is a rich history of odd looking BMWs, so they haven’t really changed tbh
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      05-24-2022, 07:22 PM   #15
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      05-24-2022, 07:53 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AHall View Post
I will definitely go take a look at one when they arrive at the dealership. I think it will be a hit though. I hope the front has a massive feel when viewed in real life. Hard for me to tell in the videos and pictures.

I do think the darker colors look better, but again will have to see in real life. I will add I also prefer the competition's cars in darker paints.
I agree that it looks sick in black with the M package.

My perfect plan, as long as the world doesn't blow up, is in 2 years I buy out my F90 lease (to preserve her long term) and lease the 760i in all black with all the bells and whistles.
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      05-24-2022, 08:00 PM   #17
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I’m a big Frank fan and mostly agree with him here. I think the X7 wears this face a lot better than the 7 does. And it only really works in either a really dark color or a super high contrast color combination (white/black).

For those who still won’t shut up about the G8x. It doesn’t matter if your sisters friend cousins brother thinks it’s ugly. And You think it’s ugly. And your grandma and her retirement home friends think it’s ugly. Apparently they were never BMW buyers because the G8X is the best selling //M of all time. And that’s record breaking units delivered to customers. Yes, individual units (not total dollar count for haters pointing to COVID markup). That’s in spite of supply shortages and price markups. At this point in the F80 life cycle I got an offer for 14% off MSRP. Others were getting more.

The bean counters at BMW know what’s up. The executives are chalking it up as validation of the designers work. In the end BMW is out to make money with controversial conversation generating designs, not to satisfy your longing for new e30.
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      05-25-2022, 02:57 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OSee View Post
I’m a big Frank fan and mostly agree with him here. I think the X7 wears this face a lot better than the 7 does. And it only really works in either a really dark color or a super high contrast color combination (white/black).

For those who still won’t shut up about the G8x. It doesn’t matter if your sisters friend cousins brother thinks it’s ugly. And You think it’s ugly. And your grandma and her retirement home friends think it’s ugly. Apparently they were never BMW buyers because the G8X is the best selling //M of all time. And that’s record breaking units delivered to customers. Yes, individual units (not total dollar count for haters pointing to COVID markup). That’s in spite of supply shortages and price markups. At this point in the F80 life cycle I got an offer for 14% off MSRP. Others were getting more.

The bean counters at BMW know what’s up. The executives are chalking it up as validation of the designers work. In the end BMW is out to make money with controversial conversation generating designs, not to satisfy your longing for new e30.
I want to believe you. What is your source that shows the G8x record breaking unit sales?
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      05-25-2022, 08:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OSee View Post
I’m a big Frank fan and mostly agree with him here. I think the X7 wears this face a lot better than the 7 does. And it only really works in either a really dark color or a super high contrast color combination (white/black).

For those who still won’t shut up about the G8x. It doesn’t matter if your sisters friend cousins brother thinks it’s ugly. And You think it’s ugly. And your grandma and her retirement home friends think it’s ugly. Apparently they were never BMW buyers because the G8X is the best selling //M of all time. And that’s record breaking units delivered to customers. Yes, individual units (not total dollar count for haters pointing to COVID markup). That’s in spite of supply shortages and price markups. At this point in the F80 life cycle I got an offer for 14% off MSRP. Others were getting more.

The bean counters at BMW know what’s up. The executives are chalking it up as validation of the designers work. In the end BMW is out to make money with controversial conversation generating designs, not to satisfy your longing for new e30.
That is a fallacy of false analogy. First of all, 5 years ago all cars had huge discounts, some as high as 20%. In the current market, BMW is actually 1 of very few giving a discount. Most cars currently have a huge mark-up. Even KIA's a going for $5-$10k over MSRP. If you think differently you haven't been shopping.

Finally, the bean counters don't know a damn thing about marketing. With a nice looking grill instead of that pig faced snout the G8x would've broken all records a long time ago and there would be $10-$20k markups on it.
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      05-25-2022, 08:12 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E66er View Post
That's exactly their reasoning - according to their research 2/3 of BMW customers want the "normal" looking cars, so they cater them with the 3 and 5, X3, X5, X7. The 1/3 wants something more daring, that's where the vertical and large snouts some in.
Why does daring have to be synonymous with fugly as ??

Ferrari and a few others seem to be able to make a daring design beautiful car. Why can't BMW??
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      05-25-2022, 08:41 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123 View Post
Ultimately these are cars I don't own and never wish to own. It doesn't excite me to see my favorite brands design language go to complete comedy but it is what it is. The difference between this new design language and bengals back in the day was that this is just redesign for the sake of doing it. There's no forward flow that reflects the past cars.

There is no longer range cohesiveness. The 3 doesn't look like the 5 like the 7 etc. which cheapens the brand a lot. The F30/F10/F01 for example is exactly what I'm talking about. They all look like bmws. And the higher range cars look like more premium versions of the other.

I say a lot on these forums and owners of cars like the G8X get annoyed at me because it rubs them the wrong way that I don't like a car they spent 80k on but I can assure you as someone in many different car communities online and in the real world, most people do not take to these new designs well at all. The current gen 4 and M3/4 which have been around for a while now are still negatively looked at. The best comments I see are "it looks ok in black." Well You should have to get a car in black with black accents to just hide the design language entirely to make it "ok" to look at. The non m sport versions of these cars are especially hideous and there's subtle things about the new 7 that are just pointless in design. It's not even the grille either because for the record, I didn't mind the facelifted G11 grille. Because the rest of the car actually looked like the car it replaced.

TL;DR- new bmws are insanely impressive on the road as drivers cars but horrible to look at.

End rant
I'm not a person who has a long history with BMW cars of the past, so my opinion may be different than most in the forum.

But, this is exactly why I purchased my M440i. I'm really glad it looks like nothing else in the BMW lineup. IMHO, any brand is watered down or "cheapened" when the models look like stretched variants if one another. It just screams, no creativity allowed.

When I stop and think about it, the only time I've ever heard anything negative about the design of the 440 was on this forum or from some "journalist" who simply repeats what the last one said. Everyone I encounter in person, wants a photo, a bit of conversation and want to know how much it costs.

I can't say that I would change a thing about my M440…..well, maybe add a manual option, but that doesn't make a break a deal for me. If that changes, I'll sell it and grab a 2023 Supra now that they've finally made it an option.
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      05-25-2022, 08:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugly Kar View Post
Why does daring have to be synonymous with fugly as ??
It's ugly according to YOU. To others, maybe yes maybe no. We'll see the sales numbers.
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