[XC3LLR8]

Just noticed TireRack is showing a new Michelin PS5, but it's on backorder, and appears to be about $200 more than going with the OEM (ZTK package) PS4S Star BMW tires.

Anyone have any experience with the new PS5? I've read the PS5 is more of an evolution rather than a revolution - so it's a little better, but not night & day. It appears to be designed to Mercedes standards, rather than BMW's, as I do not see a Star BMW option.

[BG42]

Those tires made for brands can sometimes be funny because vehicle weights they were designed for can be really different.

[jpcoop]

Remember that there's a PS4 and a PS4S and they're very much not the same thing.

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by jpcoop

Remember that there's a PS4 and a PS4S and they're very much not the same thing.

Correct, the jump from PS4 to PS4S was a revolution, not an evolution.

[jpcoop]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

Correct, the jump from PS4 to PS4S was a revolution, not an evolution.

They’re completely unrelated models aimed at different market segments. So I don’t think they expect you to cross-shop them. The 4S are the successor to the Pilot Super Sport.

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by jpcoop

They’re completely unrelated models aimed at different market segments. So I don’t think they expect you to cross-shop them. The 4S are the successor to the Pilot Super Sport.

Typing 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs PS4" into Google gives lots of reviews, so I guess they were cross-shopped quite a bit.

[BG42]

https://www.ppmc-transport.org/miche...sport-4-vs-4s/

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by BG42

https://www.ppmc-transport.org/miche...sport-4-vs-4s/

I think this article supports my previous statement...

The jump to PS5 is an evolution, whereas the jump from PS4 to PS4S is a revolution.

[BG42]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

I think this article supports my previous statement...

The jump to PS5 is an evolution, whereas the jump from PS4 to PS4S is a revolution.

I would bet there is a tad bit of marketing hype there too just to push something new. Like i said though careful with any tire designed for specific brand of car that isnt yours specs def vary.

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by BG42

I would bet there is a tad bit of marketing hype there too just to push something new. Like i said though careful with any tire designed for specific brand of car that isnt yours specs def vary.

Yeah, that's why I think I'll stick with the Star BMW tires when it comes time for a fresh replacement. I wouldn't be surprised if BMW had Michelin beef-up the sidewalls on this (ZTK) car since it's such a pig.

[BG42]

dope talk

[Winrya]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

Typing 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs PS4" into Google gives lots of reviews, so I guess they were cross-shopped quite a bit.

Completely different class of tyre. PS4 are the middle of the road tyre and the ps4s is their high performance tyre. PS5 is the replacement for the ps4. They get cross shopped because people mix them up and the ps4s are not available in a lot of the hot hatch sizes which people really want them to be. Goodyear market f1 asymmetric vs ps4 and ps5 and Goodyear supersport vs ps4s

[OriginalFake]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

Yeah, that's why I think I'll stick with the Star BMW tires when it comes time for a fresh replacement. I wouldn't be surprised if BMW had Michelin beef-up the sidewalls on this (ZTK) car since it's such a pig.

What?

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by OriginalFake

What?

The OEM tires on the ZTK are Star BMW, meaning Michelin designed the tires to BMW's specs.

In the 245/35 PS4S options there's the default Michelin option, a Hyundai option, a Mercedes option, and the BMW option.

With the M240i being so heavy, I'm guessing BMW wanted the sidewall beefed-up a little for better initial turn-in. Just a guess.

[OriginalFake]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

The OEM tires on the ZTK are Star BMW, meaning Michelin designed the tires to BMW's specs.

In the 245/35 PS4S options there's the default Michelin option, a Hyundai option, a Mercedes option, and the BMW option.

With the M240i being so heavy, I'm guessing BMW wanted the sidewall beefed-up a little for better initial turn-in. Just a guess.

Those tires are on a ton of different BMW models though, not just the M240i.

Edit: You can definitely make the argument that BMW asked Michelin for a beefed up sidewall because their cars in general are heavier but I don't think it's specific to the M240i with ZTK.

[inc235]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

The OEM tires on the ZTK are Star BMW, meaning Michelin designed the tires to BMW's specs.

In the 245/35 PS4S options there's the default Michelin option, a Hyundai option, a Mercedes option, and the BMW option.

With the M240i being so heavy, I'm guessing BMW wanted the sidewall beefed-up a little for better initial turn-in. Just a guess.

XL rated tires are 'beefed up' tire.
Same goes for RF rated tire, which stands for reinforced.
Well, they are still not beefed up as much as the Run Flat tire.
Star spec means tread compound and pattern are different.
Ask me how I know lol

[danallxt]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

I think this article supports my previous statement...

The jump to PS5 is an evolution, whereas the jump from PS4 to PS4S is a revolution.

That article is a manufacture's PR job, of course they will tout it as a "Revolution".

[danallxt]

Originally Posted by inc235

XL rated tires are 'beefed up' tire.
Same goes for RF rated tire, which stands for reinforced.
Well, they are still not beefed up as much as the Run Flat tire.
Star spec means tread compound and pattern are different.
Ask me how I know lol

Apparently the tread compound is the same, primary difference is in tread width and tire height. At least according to this response i found.
But the below info was in response to a PS2 tire, dunno if it all holds for a PS4 tire? Just info....

I made several calls to Michelin and got to the engineering dept in design...The differences are several and they all have to do with the rolling resistance of the tire. The specs. are set up by BMW engineers, who figure out what works best for overall driving of BMW's and they have the tire companys build to suit: The tires without the star have the same composition and belt design as ones with the star the width of the tires are different and the heights are different. In order the get the width differences the thread pattern maybe slightly different and the same is true for the height differences. the differences are in height of 27.05", for the non star tire and the "star" tire which is 27.0". The width differences non star is 10.24 as opposed the the "star" width is 10.02....the above was for the front tires: 255x40x19...The tech person said it is "NOT" advised to mix star and non-star tires because of height differences.

[ryo-]

I remember coming across this video on YouTube regarding the differences:

[inc235]

Originally Posted by danallxt

Apparently the tread compound is the same, primary difference is in tread width and tire height. At least according to this response i found.
But the below info was in response to a PS2 tire, dunno if it all holds for a PS4 tire? Just info....

I recently had to get a replacement tire due to sidewall bubble (running over pothole!) and got a Merc spec (MO) PS4s tire since it was available the earliest for replacement.
It was like 10 bucks cheaper than star rated, so I was like why not.
When I inspected MO spec and Star spec PS4s tires, tread patterns are different although similar. So, I'd say tread compound is likely different as well.
Also see video ryo linked.

Originally Posted by ryo-

I remember coming across this video on YouTube regarding the differences:

Yeah I remember seeing this video as well.

[XC3LLR8]

Originally Posted by danallxt

That article is a manufacture's PR job, of course they will tout it as a "Revolution".

Sounds like the PR department got it right.

[danallxt]

Originally Posted by XC3LLR8

Sounds like the PR department got it right.

Not sure what you are referring to? The utube posted by RYO is the discussion of ps4s STAR vs non star. That is a nice analysis. I recall seeing on one forum where what was being put forth was these OE specific tires were actually poorer quality tires made to minimum standards...just an example of some of the internet "babble" that is so common.

In terms of a the differences between a PS4 vs PS4s being a revolution perhaps its all semantics. But using the Michelin article itself that says this about dry performance reflects something different:

However, the Pilot Sport 4S is slightly better than the Pilot Sport 4, especially when it comes to dry braking and handling.

and in terms of wet..

On wet surfaces, it’s a little bit tricky. The Pilot Sport 4 is better in aquaplaning resistance, while the Pilot Sport 4S has better numbers in wet handling and braking.

and noise:

The slight difference between the Pilot Sport 4 and the 4S is negligible, so a tie seems more likely.

To me reading their article the 4s seems more like an mild evolution of the 4. A "revolution" in term of a performance tire would be the characteristics of Pilot Sport cup 2 vs the PS4. Or some might think the development of a runflat tire might be a revolution in tire technology.

Also in regard to the STAR rating and what it means...absolutely no consistency. You have different tire brands (Pirelli etc) doing BMW Star oe tires. And Star OE for one specific vehicle model may have different changes than the Star OE for a different model as the point supposedly is to develop a tire specific to particular vehicle...at least that's what the PR folks say. Actually OE specific performance tires tires started way back in the 1980s with Porsche.