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01-16-2020, 11:20 PM | #309 | |
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01-16-2020, 11:24 PM | #310 |
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This post is... well, kind of awesome. A bunch of men (not all, but most) on an internet forum bickering back and forth about what is, or isn't...
So I will just come out right and say it. I daily drive my F80 M3, it has been modified well beyond what is most reasonable for well... the commute back and forth to work. Has it been on a circuit track? Nope. Strip? Nope. Auto-X? Nope. Am I running an insanely aggressive fitment on wheel and tires, that are well - heavier? Yes. Changed the corner dynamics of the car? Yes. Impacted the ride quality? Yes. Suspension. Ohhh... that too, and now Ohlins R&T. Why? Oh... because aggressively dropping my car with a cheap HAS kit and 40K miles later caused the ride quality to be well, less that umm... comfortable. Yep. Intake? Yes. X-Pipe, Exhaust... Yep, basically everything Dinan sold for exhaust. Why? Because it sounded cool. You know what else sounded cool... the BavSound speakers. Why? Why? Why? Well... mainly because that's what I wanted. And usually 3-4x a month, when I need a break from my executive job, or family is driving me crazy, or because I just enjoy driving... I head out and get me a !@#$ ton of #twolanetheraphy through the backroads. Sometimes I meet up with other enthusiasts... or better yet, like last Summer - spend 30 days and 4K miles on an awesome road trip that took me through half the US, Upstate New York, Virginia, Blue Ridge Parkway, Tail of the Dragon, Atlanta, Nashvile... (WHY ARE YOU STILL READING THIS BTW??) And yeah... I've done the same to the C63S and M2C as well. Why? Why? Why? Well... because that's what I want. My recommended... do what you want, and tell the other guy to GTFO if they don't like what you want or do. #rantover
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01-16-2020, 11:24 PM | #311 | |||
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01-16-2020, 11:27 PM | #312 |
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The M340 actually gained weight, I believe its only the platform that is lighter, not the vehicle as a whole. There's a whole thread on the G20 forums talking about it. https://g20.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1599263
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01-16-2020, 11:27 PM | #313 | ||||||
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Sure for 15k on an m550 you can do some Downpipes, some tune, some meth maybe some cheap turbos..... but my point is that does not equal and ///M car. You may make it just as fast on paper but it's not the same. I have gone down this road myself and ya the capability is there to go from good to great but it all comes at a cost and it will never be the sum of its parts. I just want people to be real here. It's completely irrational and diminutive when people claim they can make a non ///M into an M. I argue you can do a lot and that's great but it's NOT and ///M. I'm sorry but the R&D dollars that go into all of these models is not trivial and does produce real performance products. Here are the things you won't get trying to get the m550 to an M5 for our 15k arguments example: You will not get the weight reduction In the body panels, you will not get the breaks, you will not get the crazy xdrive or even the electronic diffs. You will not get the upgraded low pressure or high pressure cooling systems. You will not get twin scroll turbos with electronic waste gates. You will not get a carbon fiber roof. You will not get a tuned and rated ZF matched to the engine. You will not get the suspension, the wheels, the tires the underbody aero, the exhaust. You won't even get the seats.... my point throughout all of my trolling. Has been this. These cars are all really fucking good and capable. But if it's not designed by the Motorsport division, it's stupid to diminish it and not realize how those developments with each generation feed down to the all of the models elevating them with each new gen. The top of the tree that the ///M division designs and builds is not easily replicable and certainly not for 15k. But if all you care about is saying "it's as fast as an ///M." You're missing the point.
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01-16-2020, 11:32 PM | #314 | |
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While I agree with you in some points, you are literally putting under a question mark all your intentions by perpetually hitting the M owners with that "insecurity", while all your posts are just a narcissistic way of reassuring yourself about how smart and clever you are by choosing vehicles that are not M but which are " a hair apart from an M vehicle". I do own a simple X line vehicle, and looking for my next M, yet I will never put them together, because they are not. yeah, preach your poetry as long as you want but you: - either lack knowledge in the field, - either your senses are dead - either you are just in here to reiterate to yourself what a good decision you have made. Same goes for TV's or Audio field where many look the same, yet a deaf or a blind guy can not see the difference. Many swear on their "blue faces" (to use your words), that their speakers are absolutely better than some very expensive ones where beryllium is used, and can not justify the price. Fair enough, but stop preaching in here your poor perception. If you are unable to see what people that are specialists in the field can see, that doesn';t mean that you are correct. Also, if BMW calls the X3M and X5M or X6M an M vehicle who are you to say that they are not? Do you have the definition of M? Or did you read somewhere that M is actually a certain class of its own where the center of gravity must not go over a certain height from the ground level? If you don't see the X5M or X6M as an M car that is your problem, but they are as they do benefit from certain materials, technical approach, different engineering, track inspired technology and more power. Don't care about your opinion about soccer mom's with 600HP! is immature and shows your condescending approach! That is nobody's business and can not be included in an enthusiast forum. It is just a different vehicle for different purposes. An M3 will not take me skiing or hiking where I want -and where I am usually going- with the speed and comfort I am looking for, but an X6 will. Is just a bigger different animal, but if you have a bigger imagination and see that X6 from the helicopter in the field, you will get its purpose. So is the Ford Raptor which will not stay beside the M3. But the M3 will not stay beside that Raptor either. Depends on the situation. In the end, stop blaming the M owners, that they are hurt. From where I am sitting, it seems that actually you are the one that is hurt, not them as they have no reason to. Actually, people like you are the ones that are promoting disdain inside the brand. Be happy with what you have and enjoy, but stop trying to preach in here the so little differences between BMW models. They are very different and the prices obviously reflect that and people that do have some real weight in the field say the same. The new M340 is a beast on its own reported to the actual cars, but the new M3 will be far apart. It's called evolution. Is true that many are not using the limits of a normal BMW and I passed many cool cars with my 4 cyl but that doesn't mean that mine is better. Some buy their M's for their technical specifications, some buy it for their image or just because they want the best. Each of us have its own perception, but a perception will not replace the facts. Last edited by Teutonic; 01-18-2020 at 12:29 PM.. |
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01-16-2020, 11:33 PM | #315 |
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Lest I get misunderstood, I would like to say that a M car is a totally different beast to the M Performance car. It's entire package renders it a different car. Forget the power dynamics alone. That doesn't give the M car it's proper dues. For me it's the whole theatrics, dynamics of the car that make it a class if it's own. But that said, these M Performance cars are really special and deserve their props as well. The M division has an active hand in their engine tuning and driving dynamics and that's a fact, not some insinuation because of the several M bits that are littered across the car. To say that it's a 330i or 340i with some M sport adornments betrays one's level of understanding. The M240i and M340i should be respected, and they are not meant to transcend their M counterparts.
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01-16-2020, 11:56 PM | #316 |
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01-17-2020, 12:13 AM | #317 |
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Yep. I test drove a M340i. Night and day difference in driving feel. M340i felt like my previous 340i. M3 feels completely different. Its composure on the road is amazing.
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01-17-2020, 12:14 AM | #318 | |||||||
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What you stated, you don't think BMW uses the same technology to cool these rapid cars as it's M cars? I'd imagine they wouldn't want tons of warranty claims on their part, break downs and an unreliable car. You don't think AMG has no part in their C43. You think the M division has absolutely no part in the MP cars at all, and if they don't then BMW GmbH doesn't try to replicate the technology from their M division in these cars? Do you know specifically that BMW M GmbH doesn't have any involvement, I'm talking even blueprints. Hell I even see BMW components in Mini's as I do Rolls Royce such as coils. Unless you are stating all this as fact (which I doubt) Technology is being shared, hence the Supra. 8 years ago I would be on the same page as you (and what most M boys still believe) as far as increasing output and balancing load & pressure, as well as drivetrain... now it's just not there. It's a new era mein fruend. Gaps are bridging the same as an M8, M5 or S65 is bridging the McClarens and Lamborghini's. |
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01-17-2020, 12:20 AM | #319 |
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If the M340 is an M car, then The Black Eyed Peas is Hip Hop.
BMW hasn't made a true M car in 7 years, anyway.
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Last edited by cjm41; 01-17-2020 at 12:30 AM.. |
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01-17-2020, 12:30 AM | #320 |
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Sooooo....whats the 1M/M2 considered?
With its non S engine, half an M car? I mean the VIN starts with WBS..... Some of you elitist say its the wrong engine, M Performance models are closing the gap in straight line speed but they lack many other components. Yet you also claim its not all about straight line speed Seems you change the story constantly to align with those elitist beliefs, more toxic than anything. You guys are absolutely ridiculous |
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01-17-2020, 12:41 AM | #321 |
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I just like to read all the comments from those that [from looking at their previous posts in other threads] don't even own ANY of the cars that they make reference to in here... making mad comments about F and G platform variants - regardless of the ///M, M Performance, or M Sport model.
Would that technically be "posing to be a poser?!" Is that term still in use? [it has after all been quite a few years since I was in high school] And here I was thinking I was back on Twitter after stumbling onto this thread!
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01-17-2020, 12:54 AM | #322 | |
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It's a bit of a laugh people arguing about diluting the purity of the M line - the rot actually started when the e36 M3 came out in the USA with a tarted up 240hp M50 rather than the proper S50 Euro engine. BMW made amends with the e46, but by then it was already too late |
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01-17-2020, 01:45 AM | #323 |
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This was predictable. First, 'M Performance' is misleading, as it sounds more upmarket than just M when it is in fact the opposite. Second, 'M Performance' is highly ambiguous, since it designates both the M light model lineup and the sporty accessory range which is available for the whole BMW lineup, when in fact the latter neither constitutes nor overlaps with the former.
To those complaining that this move 'waters down' the M brand: this claim itself implies that the branding seems to matter more to you than the vehicles' actual hardware and philosophy, which is precisely what you claim being puristic about in the first place as opposed to drivers of the more pedestrian M light models. So far the hardcore M models differ significantly from their M light counterparts, this quantum leap is what should matter the most as long as it remains true. Besides, M being BMW's performance branch, it only makes sense that BMW's whole sports universe (various layers of performance models, performance enhancing or purely aesthetic accessories...) be included under this umbrella. Last edited by advantage20; 01-17-2020 at 07:46 AM.. |
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01-17-2020, 01:53 AM | #324 |
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Yes same in the UK. An M section.
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01-17-2020, 01:59 AM | #325 | |
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Usain Bolt is fast.....but that alone doesn't mean he would be an All-Pro NFL WR. He would never even be close.
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01-17-2020, 02:41 AM | #327 | ||
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Le me explain something to you, in performance and racing - track times and trap speed is ALL that matters. Or what's the point of the M2CS, the 39 more hp lol? If I was really a numbers only guy I would say something ignorant like "bro the M5 has 144 more horsepower than the M550i and a 0-69 in 3.1675 seconds, bro". ...and yes we know you're M5 slaloms better than the M550i through those curves on your way home from work. Never did I once say the M550i is a superior car to the M5 or any of the cross platforms, or that it's meant to overachieve over the Flagship M's whatsoever. Logic dictates that the M5 can be tuned also to McLaren numbers. My entire argument is that the gap is bridged between the M550i / 340i compared to M's (let me add those lines for you too ///M), and that these are worthy cars of the M moniker and BMW GmbH no matter how butthurt //////M you are about it. |
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01-17-2020, 02:48 AM | #328 |
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You know what? BMW should just do like Honda and keep adding R's or (M's in our case.)
Civic Type R? Peon. Real Bros drive the Mugen Civic RR Likewise nothing is sadder than a guy on a CBR1000RR, except maybe someone on a CBR1000R i guess. Anyway the point is CBR1000RR-R. RR owners will weep when they see my RR-R. That's three races you can just go ahead and assume i won right there, four if you count the one in "CBR." I want to drive an MM330ciMMMM Gran Coupe, and i'll settle for nothing less. |
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01-17-2020, 02:54 AM | #329 |
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they've already diluted the M brand anyway.
first it was turbos then awd SUVs Then M cars without an S motor (M2) then no manual option (M5, M3cs) now you dont even get a DCT option honestly wouldn't be suprised if they come out with an M2 convertible or X7M in a few years.
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01-17-2020, 03:04 AM | #330 | |
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The M performance cars are not a real M car......END. OF. STORY. M cars are not all about speed.......and if I were to pull up next to a M340 or M550, I'll never say "yay, there is another M car." Ever. The M550i is just that.....a 550i at the end of the day. Better than a 540....better than a 530.....but most definitely not a M5, either. The M550 is a great car....but I've driven it twice since I got my M5. It's apples and oranges. Someone earlier mentioned this whoring out was similar to what Benz has done with the AMG models. I don't like comparing the M Performance cars versus the cheap-ass AMG models (again, not talking about C63, S63, E63, etc....but models like the E43 or whatever it's called). Those lower AMG models are SLOW....the M Performance cars at least have an actual power upgrade more worthy of the name. There, you are paying for the AMG name even though the car really has zero upgrades over the other models. Bottom line is there is more to the M name than power nowadays. Maybe it didn't always use to be that way but handling and suspension are major differences. The comfort mode (I am talking about handling and suspension, not power) in my M5 is way way way more aggressive/firmer/tighter than even the sport plus in my M550.
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Last edited by mjr24; 01-17-2020 at 03:14 AM.. |
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