Pinned Crank Hub Failure - Installation Error or Possible design issue?

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 08:46 PM

See link: https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...1&postcount=80

Basically the guy’s tuner said that the Maxpsi CH had a major fail. He said “The issue was at the pin site it was actually backing itself out, and the oil cog I believe had a bunch of premature wear.”

Now is this one of those rare pinned hub failures due to installation error? Or possible design issue?

Not trying to throw shade at the MPSI CH, but just concerned as I’m going to look for a solid fix in the near future.

Ghosn · 04-11-2020, 09:06 PM

This has always been one of my concerns if I ever went down this path. You get a crank up fix done and something goes bang afterwards.

How will you ever know if the fix actually failed or the installation wasn't done correctly and you are left to cover all the damage and two parties blaming each other.

LINF83 · 04-11-2020, 09:16 PM

It was the bolts backing it out

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

It was the bolts backing it out

Just read that as well. So I thought the bolt wouldn’t back out even with a pinned design. So regardless of what fix you have, you need the capture?

LINF83 · 04-11-2020, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

It was the bolts backing it out

Just read that as well. So I thought the bolt wouldn’t back out even with a pinned design. So regardless of what fix you have, you need the capture?

From my understanding bolt capture will help (having it installed won't hurt you ) , but there is people out there saying wouldn't do anything.

I use to have vtt v1 with the bolt capture on my car and I just recently pulled out and went for insane performance crank hub and I use vtt bolt capture on the ip crank hub

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

From my understanding bolt capture will help (having it installed won't hurt you ) , but there is people out there saying wouldn't do anything.

I use to have vtt v1 with the bolt capture on my car and I just recently pulled out and went for insane performance crank hub and I use vtt bolt capture on the ip crank hub

Oh! How was the uninstall of the V1? Did it actually dig into the crank? Did you have to use the special tool to remove?

MR RIZK · 04-11-2020, 09:52 PM

The central bolt backing out is known to happen on other manufacturers also. For the sake of a 100 bucks why the fuck wouldn't you install it if just paid ~3k for a upgraded hub.

Just blows me away sometimes. Each to their own I guess.

It is great that the poster clarified his statements otherwise we would have had another 50 pages of speculation.

https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=26037427

/rant

LINF83 · 04-11-2020, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

From my understanding bolt capture will help (having it installed won't hurt you ) , but there is people out there saying wouldn't do anything.

I use to have vtt v1 with the bolt capture on my car and I just recently pulled out and went for insane performance crank hub and I use vtt bolt capture on the ip crank hub

Oh! How was the uninstall of the V1? Did it actually dig into the crank? Did you have to use the special tool to remove?

Unfortunately it did not dig into the end of the crank. I don't think you will need a special tools to pull it out.

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

Unfortunately it did not dig into the end of the crank. I don't think you will need a special tools to pull it out.

Jeez thats a bummer. I hope the V2 works better!

guess2098 · 04-11-2020, 10:18 PM

I heard v2 will dig into the crank pretty bad. not sure its true of not. but i am probably change to v2 soon if not going to a build engine...

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guess2098

I heard v2 will dig into the crank pretty bad. not sure its true of not. but i am probably change to v2 soon if not going to a build engine...

What do you have now?

guess2098 · 04-11-2020, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Quote:

Originally Posted by guess2098

I heard v2 will dig into the crank pretty bad. not sure its true of not. but i am probably change to v2 soon if not going to a build engine...

What do you have now?

V1, but vtt they offer free upgrade only pay for labor

jpy1980 · 04-11-2020, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guess2098

V1, but vtt they offer free upgrade only pay for labor

Nice. Good luck! Keep us posted on how it goes.

Djdnav · 04-12-2020, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Just read that as well. So I thought the bolt wouldn’t back out even with a pinned design. So regardless of what fix you have, you need the capture?

Exactly how do you presume adding a pinned hub would stop the bolt from becoming loose?

jpy1980 · 04-12-2020, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djdnav

Exactly how do you presume adding a pinned hub would stop the bolt from becoming loose?

It’s not what I believe, as I already have a CBC installed, but it’s what people have said when installing the pinned designed hub from what I read on the forum. If I were to ever do a complete fix, I would always add the CBC.

cheveux · 04-12-2020, 12:49 PM

The central screw will always be able to loosen. It is not so common with keyed solutions because for something to be damaged, the length of the key would have to be loosened, in addition, those who assemble these solutions always tend to tighten the central screw with more torque than the original screw. The cbc will always help or even completely stop the screw from loosening. In my opinion, if it is not to modify the car with turbos, the cbc is a good initial bet. Anyway if I switched to a key solution, I would always put cbc for security, always.

calubi · 04-12-2020, 01:56 PM

Glad I had the CBC installed at the same time as my MaxPSI crank hub!

Beemerm3 · 04-14-2020, 02:00 AM

Seem like he was going off a story on fb. The guy had a code to check his maxpsi. But we haven’t heard back from him.

TheMaster1971NL · 04-14-2020, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyF80

From my understanding bolt capture will help (having it installed won't hurt you ) , but there is people out there saying wouldn't do anything.

I use to have vtt v1 with the bolt capture on my car and I just recently pulled out and went for insane performance crank hub and I use vtt bolt capture on the ip crank hub

I did the same

behindthen0thing · 04-15-2020, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3classic

Seem like he was going off a story on fb. The guy had a code to check his maxpsi. But we haven’t heard back from him.

Maybe he should've checked the spark plugs

ASRman · 04-15-2020, 02:04 PM

Should always fit the CBC either in isolation or in conjunction with an aftermarket hub. Plenty of fanboys seem to hate on the CBC without apparent reason. Bottom line is the CBC is an effective way of preventing backing out of the central screw only, period. Given there have been plenty of examples of hub failures where upon strip down the central screw has been found to be finger tight, I suggest it is mandatory to have a CBC installed when running even a stage 1 tune. Of course the hub can still slip internally via friction disc failure, that is where the an aftermarket one piece hub comes into play.

Beemerm3 · 04-16-2020, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by behindthen0thing

Maybe he should've checked the spark plugs

I would block you if I could. You act like everyone is right on this forum. You should work for BMW and get paid.

04-11-2020, 08:46 PM	#1
jpy1980 Lieutenant Colonel 1583 Rep 1,976 Posts Drives: 2015 BMW M3 -Smurfy Blue Vinyl Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Los Angeles iTrader: (3)	Pinned Crank Hub Failure - Installation Error or Possible design issue? See link: https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...1&postcount=80 Basically the guy’s tuner said that the Maxpsi CH had a major fail. He said “The issue was at the pin site it was actually backing itself out, and the oil cog I believe had a bunch of premature wear.” Now is this one of those rare pinned hub failures due to installation error? Or possible design issue? Not trying to throw shade at the MPSI CH, but just concerned as I’m going to look for a solid fix in the near future.
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04-11-2020, 09:06 PM	#2
Ghosn Lieutenant 464 Rep 495 Posts Drives: M3 Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Melbourne iTrader: (0)	This has always been one of my concerns if I ever went down this path. You get a crank up fix done and something goes bang afterwards. How will you ever know if the fix actually failed or the installation wasn't done correctly and you are left to cover all the damage and two parties blaming each other. __________________ 2018 ///M3 ZCP Mineral White \| Black Leather \| DCT Last edited by Ghosn; 04-11-2020 at 09:13 PM..
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04-11-2020, 09:16 PM	#3
LINF83 Lieutenant 854 Rep 445 Posts Drives: F80 Join Date: Feb 2019 Location: Maryalnd-DMV iTrader: (0)	It was the bolts backing it out
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04-11-2020, 09:52 PM	#7
MR RIZK Major 758 Rep 1,337 Posts Drives: AW M2C Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Australia iTrader: (0)	The central bolt backing out is known to happen on other manufacturers also. For the sake of a 100 bucks why the fuck wouldn't you install it if just paid ~3k for a upgraded hub. Just blows me away sometimes. Each to their own I guess. It is great that the poster clarified his statements otherwise we would have had another 50 pages of speculation. https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=26037427 /rant __________________ Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
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04-11-2020, 10:18 PM	#10
guess2098 Major 516 Rep 1,247 Posts Drives: 2022 Taycan GTS, 2018 M4, 2016 Join Date: May 2009 Location: Rowland Heights, CA iTrader: (5)	I heard v2 will dig into the crank pretty bad. not sure its true of not. but i am probably change to v2 soon if not going to a build engine...
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04-12-2020, 12:49 PM	#16
cheveux Second Lieutenant 407 Rep 205 Posts Drives: 2014 M4 Join Date: May 2018 Location: Portugal iTrader: (0)	The central screw will always be able to loosen. It is not so common with keyed solutions because for something to be damaged, the length of the key would have to be loosened, in addition, those who assemble these solutions always tend to tighten the central screw with more torque than the original screw. The cbc will always help or even completely stop the screw from loosening. In my opinion, if it is not to modify the car with turbos, the cbc is a good initial bet. Anyway if I switched to a key solution, I would always put cbc for security, always.
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04-12-2020, 01:56 PM	#17
calubi Private First Class 27 Rep 125 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Comp Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: Ohio iTrader: (0)	Glad I had the CBC installed at the same time as my MaxPSI crank hub!
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04-14-2020, 02:00 AM	#18
Beemerm3 First Lieutenant 59 Rep 345 Posts Drives: 16' BMW m3 Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: Sacramento iTrader: (0)	Seem like he was going off a story on fb. The guy had a code to check his maxpsi. But we haven’t heard back from him.
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04-15-2020, 02:04 PM	#21
ASRman Private First Class 103 Rep 125 Posts Drives: F80 M3 competition 2018 Join Date: May 2019 Location: United States iTrader: (0)	Should always fit the CBC either in isolation or in conjunction with an aftermarket hub. Plenty of fanboys seem to hate on the CBC without apparent reason. Bottom line is the CBC is an effective way of preventing backing out of the central screw only, period. Given there have been plenty of examples of hub failures where upon strip down the central screw has been found to be finger tight, I suggest it is mandatory to have a CBC installed when running even a stage 1 tune. Of course the hub can still slip internally via friction disc failure, that is where the an aftermarket one piece hub comes into play.
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